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Docker Raises $23M

docker.com

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Re: Docker Raises $23M

#211

Post by Fiahil »

caymanjim wrote: post #140
filleokus wrote: post #76

It feels like Docker (Inc) is becoming less and less "relevant" for each year that passes. At least from my perspective, they led the popularisation of containerisation and the whole cattle-not-pets approach of deploying apps. They created big and long lasting change in the industry. But they seem to have lost the production environment race to Kubernetes, at least for now. They are the biggest player in the dev-mach…

Kubernetes is so much more than most people should want or need. It's far too complicated and heavyweight for smaller or simpler deployments. In AWS, most people should use ECS/Fargate instead. There are other competing container environments as well. Your point still stands; Docker popularized containerization and are in danger of becoming irrelevant because they ceded the container execution environment to others.

I think you missed the biggest value proposition of Kubernetes: the scheduling and container orchestration are nice, but that's not why you use it. Portability is the killer feature. Being able to stand up reproductively a clustered application without relying on custom-made sh script and ansible playbooks is a godsend. Using ECS goes against portability and just coerce you into more vendor lock-ins.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#212

Post by u801e »

sombremesa wrote: post #142
TheGRS wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And Slack is just IRC for people who don't know better am I right?

It pretty much is. A lot of people still use Git GUIs and automatic transmission has handily beaten manual transmission in the US - not everyone understands or even wants to understand the tech they use.

Regarding transmission though, why hasn't the automatic transmission handly beaten the manual transmission in the rest of the world? My guess is because of the increased cost of maintenance and repair. I guess people are more willing to pay for support when abtracting the internals of their VCS away compared to others who understand it at a low level.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#213

Post by goatinaboat »

ncrmro wrote: post #206
goatinaboat wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I beg to differ. The jump from learning Docker (and containers generally) to learning Kubernetes is not “hard”. Unless you are at a scale that you can employ a full-time Kubernetes team, you probably don't need Kubernetes, and if you insist on using it for production anyway, you absolutely should use one of the many managed offerings (DO is probably cheapest, I have no affiliation with them), or shrinkwrapped product…

Actually with k3s it’s pretty dang simple!

Production workload on k3s? It’s what you run on a laptop!

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#214

Post by u801e »

TheGRS wrote: post #145
sombremesa wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It pretty much is. A lot of people still use Git GUIs and automatic transmission has handily beaten manual transmission in the US - not everyone understands or even wants to understand the tech they use.

Point being that there is value in the abstraction, people value it, people pay for it. I know how to use a stick shift and I'll still pay for automatic for the ease of use.

Though for one who is experienced driving a vehicle with a manual transmission, a lot of the actions become second nature, meaning that it's not really more or less difficult to use. The only time a manual transmission vehicle is arguably more difficult to drive is in stop and go traffic, but I've handled that by maintaining a larger following distance and trying to maintain pace at idle speed in first or second gear.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#216

Post by thow-01187 »

halfmatthalfcat wrote: post #176
caymanjim wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kubernetes is so much more than most people should want or need. It's far too complicated and heavyweight for smaller or simpler deployments. In AWS, most people should use ECS/Fargate instead. There are other competing container environments as well. Your point still stands; Docker popularized containerization and are in danger of becoming irrelevant because they ceded the container execution environment to others.

I beg to differ. The jump from learning Docker (and containers generally) to learning Kubernetes is not “hard”. Sure it’s a different paradigm of application deployment but I’ve seen far too many posts on HN that completely undermine its value in the name of difficulty. You can use it if you’re not “at scale” completely fine and reap all the benefits as if you were. Idk it’s because people hate Google, so they hate K…

In my experience, adopting Kubernetes is seldom a well informed decision weighting the pros and the cons. Usually it's a stampede effect of higher-ups pushing for Kubernetes, because everyone else is, without really understanding what it entails.

The truth is, Kubernetes is awesome, it brings many features to the table. But it also requires ~10% additional very expensive headcount, ~20% more tasks overall, and prolongs the release cycle by ~20%. Figures are from my experience. Those drawbacks are rarely ever discussed - it's just dumped onto existing teams on top of their existing responsibilities, leading to struggle and frustration.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#217

Post by pjmlp »

ColdHeat wrote: post #179
IceWreck wrote: post #120

Does the Docker company even do anything to stay relevant? * The popularized containers but their core tool has been replaced by superior alternatives like Podman. * They sold their enterprise registry which wouldve earned them actual money. * The consumer registry has tons of free/cheaper alternatives like github's container registry, something from gitlab and on the enterprise side, there is Red Hat's quay. * Docke…

I mostly agree here but I'm not really sure that Podman has replaced Docker. I'm also curious how you're determining that Podman is superior to Docker?

It definitely has on Red-Hat.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#218

Post by pjmlp »

revskill wrote: post #143

I just wish Windows has built-in Docker so that i don't need to install anything like wsl,... Make docker run on bare-metal Windows is a huge improvement to my life ! Why? WSL or VM is stupid because it costs around 5-6GB of RAM without doing anything.

Windows has containers, no need to use WSL.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#219

Post by pjmlp »

initplus wrote: post #209
mav3rick wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a container runtime / API to abstract this. Pretty sure Windows has equivalents of namespaces and cgroups.

The docker tools themselves ARE cross platform, but 99% of docker images in the wild are based off Linux, and have ELF binaries inside. Windows does not have equivalents for every single Linux system call. This is why you need WSL. You can build an image based on a Windows base image, and run it natively in Windows.

Which makes sense, containers aren't virtual machines.

Re: Docker Raises $23M

#220

Post by thow-01187 »

Fiahil wrote: post #211
caymanjim wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kubernetes is so much more than most people should want or need. It's far too complicated and heavyweight for smaller or simpler deployments. In AWS, most people should use ECS/Fargate instead. There are other competing container environments as well. Your point still stands; Docker popularized containerization and are in danger of becoming irrelevant because they ceded the container execution environment to others.

I think you missed the biggest value proposition of Kubernetes: the scheduling and container orchestration are nice, but that's not why you use it. Portability is the killer feature. Being able to stand up reproductively a clustered application without relying on custom-made sh script and ansible playbooks is a godsend. Using ECS goes against portability and just coerce you into more vendor lock-ins.

This is big in enterprise software.

Some corporate customers have bare-metal servers, some OpenStack, some run in AWS, some on VMWare, some on Azure, more exotic options are not rare either.

Kubernetes smooths out the differences, letting you develop an application against a standard, google-able API that is deployable anywhere.

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