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NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

reuters.com

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Re: NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

#211

Post by inglor »

inglor wrote: post #201
milofeynman wrote: post #9

The article doesn't really say what hackers had access to, but it sounds like they had full control over their phones. There is a lot bigger story here and I'd love to read a post-mortem in a few months. Also, WhatsApp is such an obvious target for a state actor. I saw several articles of the last year that mentioned Jared Kushner using Whatsapp so I assume a lot of government folks use it for off the books "encrypte…

NSO still have multiple ubpatched 0 days in WhatsApp Telegram and most other messaging apps. Your best bet is to use something obscure so you cannot easily be targeted or not being connected to the same net. At the Israeli army we had phones that ran completely separate software stacks and talked to a different network for this. Nothing was on the internet.

Also since modem stacks are so terrible - ideally two phones where one is just a hotspot for the other one and the one using the hotspot does not have a cellular modem. Also ideally not Android or iOS.

Of course it is better to not be on the public internet with any sensitive device if at all possible. Anything on the internet is considered public.

Re: NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

#212

Post by celticninja »

ineedasername wrote: post #174
blotter_paper wrote: post #16

Which is hilarious and hypocritical, since the government keeps talking about making end-to-end encryption apps illegal to distribute without backdoors. Now they're using an encryption app with a backdoor,* and they're upset about it? I thought this is what they wanted! *I know, I know, this probably wasn't done with a backdoor -- it's just funnier to lie in this context.

I guess they just don't like the inconvenience of having to find the backdoors on their own. It's hard work! But hard work has never killed anyone* *With the exception of people forced to work to death, or under unsafe conditions, or that were doing a perfectly reasonable amount of hard work that none the less triggered a heart attack. Or...

Depends, if months of hard work results in a drive strike, it could be said to have killed some one.

Re: NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

#214

Post by dheera »

milofeynman wrote: post #9

The article doesn't really say what hackers had access to, but it sounds like they had full control over their phones. There is a lot bigger story here and I'd love to read a post-mortem in a few months. Also, WhatsApp is such an obvious target for a state actor. I saw several articles of the last year that mentioned Jared Kushner using Whatsapp so I assume a lot of government folks use it for off the books "encrypte…

This is why I've been telling everyone that WhatsApp end-to-end encryption is moot if the client isn't open-source.

Nobody listens though, until something like this happens.

Re: NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

#215

Post by inglor »

gesman wrote: post #213

So i wonder about a ways of implementing secure communications using untrusted device over untrusted channels.

You can just encrypt it before typing it down and send encrypted text so the cleartext is never on the device. It's just not convenient at all though theoretically this can be a separate device that is not connected to the internet.

Re: NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

#216

Post by carlmr »

lostcolony wrote: post #165
dan-robertson wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If one assumes that WhatsApp are implementing the protocol as well as signal are (which I do), then I think there are three questions in deciding what is more secure: 1. Do you trust Facebook (or open whisper systems) with your metadata/expect them to delete it? 2. How likely are there to be bugs (in the app, not in the protocol itself) which lead to exploits. On the one hand WhatsApp probably have more people workin…

'On the one hand WhatsApp probably have more people working on the app' From a career in software development, I tend to feel that the more devs, the buggier. Maybe, MAYBE (number of QA)/(number of devs) = reliability coefficient.

Correlates with my experience, too, however size of the QA team is not a reliable indicator. I've seen it first hand where the QA is huge, but doesn't have good devs, only people that point out process flaws.

Re: NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

#217

Post by matt_j »

Answerawake wrote: post #194
mullen wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no reason why other well educated countries could being doing the same thing, but with the Israeli's, nothing is off the table. If a company in Israeli learns how to hack WhatsApp, that is seen as an advantage for the Israeli government. If an American company learns how to hack WhatsApp, they bound by ethics to let WhatsApp know and make sure the issue is fixed. Israeli culture thinks that is crazy to do th…

Sounds like they are morally bankrupt. This is not something to be proud of in today's world.

I agree that it isn't a trait to be proud of, but show me a government that isn't morally bankrupt and I'll show you a government that you don't know enough about.

Being civilized seems to be a low priority in the civilized world.

Re: NSO hacked WhatsApp to spy on top government officials at U.S. allies

#220

Post by yairchu »

kick wrote: post #168
jonplackett wrote: post #104

What are Israel doing to get so good at this and chip design and weapons making and everything else they seem to be really good at? There’s only about 8 million people in the whole country. There are plenty of cities with more people than that. How come they punch so far above their weight?

High levels of investment, mandatory military service, and exceptionally good education. If you ever get the chance to talk to someone from Israel, especially someone in tech who was raised in Israel, I recommend it. Ask them about where they went to school. You'll learn a lot.

> exceptionally good education.

Is that so?!

I’m an Israeli and I assumed that it’s the really bad education that is responsible for stronger skepticism and Chutzpah.

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