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How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

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Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#211

Post by subhro »

barrkel wrote: post #57
JacKTrocinskI wrote: post #6

Or just go to a hotel! I have a condo in a building where most of the units are listed on Airbnb or Booking.com, quality of life for residents like me has been drastically reduced by noisy tourists that come for a weekend trip and have no regard for keeping it quiet or keeping the shared spaces clean. I hope more cities begin to ban Airbnb. Tourists belong in hotels not in buildings where families try to live their d…

Hotels with self catering and a door between living area and sleeping area are scarce on the ground and often overpriced. Even something as simple as a fridge with usable space, not packed with minibar stuff, is hard to find. Hotels aren't very comfortable places to stay.

I forget the exact chain, but wasn't Embassy Suites or Homewood suites (or some Marriott brand), was an exclusively, living room + dining + kitchen + bedroom setup? They were also much cheaper than typical JW Marriott, regular Marriott and similar hotels.

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#212

Post by jkoudys »

JacKTrocinskI wrote: post #6

Or just go to a hotel! I have a condo in a building where most of the units are listed on Airbnb or Booking.com, quality of life for residents like me has been drastically reduced by noisy tourists that come for a weekend trip and have no regard for keeping it quiet or keeping the shared spaces clean. I hope more cities begin to ban Airbnb. Tourists belong in hotels not in buildings where families try to live their d…

That's great for the people who have an easy time affording their units and can pay a premium for the peace and quiet. I bought in a building that banned airbnb 2 weeks after my purchase. We go away often on weekends or for a 1-month stint each year (my wife's family is overseas), and that extra income would've really helped us make ends meet. Our floor still has to listen to the couple in an abusive marriage scream at each other at 2am several times a week, but at least we don't have strangers asking for sugar or directions to the grocery store, right?

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#213

Post by learc83 »

nsajko wrote: post #188
danesparza wrote: post #167

Just to be clear, AirBnB has rules about cameras: https://www.airbnb.com/help/article/887/what-are-airbnbs-rul... Note that you can get a full refund if the host breaks these rules.

> we require hosts to disclose all security cameras and other recording devices in their listings, and we prohibit any security cameras and other recording devices that are in or that observe the interior of certain private spaces (such as bedrooms and bathrooms), regardless of whether they’ve been disclosed.

Banning them only in bedrooms and bathrooms is insane. Common spaces aren't public spaces if you rent out the whole place.

If you can't rent out your place without recording your renters, you dont need to be renting.

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#214

Post by TeMPOraL »

scld wrote: post #141
TeMPOraL wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now for the counterargument: Airbnb is evil, because it facilitates and profits from rule and lawbreaking, up to and including turning whole apartment buildings into pirate hotels, while spinning the tale that it's all about individuals occasionally renting out their primary place of residence for a couple of days. It's evil because while occasional random temporary sublets aren't a problem, they become a problem whe…

Unlafwul in no way implies evil. For every reason that AirBnB is "evil" for breaking the law, you could come up with a reason that the law is "evil" for existing in the first place.

> Unlafwul in no way implies evil.

Not always, but typically it does, as one usually breaks laws to benefit themselves at the expense of others, either direct or through second-order effects.

> For every reason that AirBnB is "evil" for breaking the law, you could come up with a reason that the law is "evil" for existing in the first place.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Whether or not the laws need changing doesn't justify breaking them (or encouraging people to do so), especially not when that act of disobedience has well-understood and well-documented negative consequences to society at large. It's not like AirBnB (or Uber) are doing this to make the world a better place - they figured out a business model that's essentially burning social trust and cohesion as if it was a fuel.

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#215

Post by jkoudys »

dylan604 wrote: post #208
terryf wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of the reasons I don't stay in airbnbs - the system breaks the social contract. The reason hotels are more expensive is because they have to follow a bunch of rules that makes everyone's life a bit better by having insurance for risks and zoning and so on. However you have to pay a bit more. So, if you ever find yourself complaining "I wish people did something in a not the absolute cheapest and effortles…

> However you have to pay a bit more. I've been looking into AirBnB for certain situations, and because people tell me they are cheaper than hotels. However, I have found that in a lot of cases, hotels end up being cheaper. The big gotcha is the prices shown are the fee for the room (or house or whatever), but then at the end they tack on exorbitant "cleaning" fees that I have found to be greater than the rental fee.…

Yeah those cleaning fees are bullshit. I don't want to see the prices of only one item on a list shown on the map, I want to see how much it actually costs to stay there.

tbf you'll see this on a lot of hotel bookings too. We just got back from a week in NYC, and most booking systems (either hotels or airbnbs) were a massive slog. Try to airbnb an okay place in the Bronx for $110/night? Click through and see an $80 cleaning fee. Try to book a hotel in Manhattan? Bam, $100 tourism tax.

Really not loving all these systems that go out of there way to confuse me into paying more money.

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#216

Post by jobigoud »

dfxm12 wrote: post #168
celeritascelery wrote: post #144

What is your recourse if you do happen to find a hidden camera? I mean, is it illegal for someone to hide a camera in their own house and not tell you?

Regardless of local law, it's against AirBNB's TOS to have an undisclosed camera in the room. You should contact them. https://www.airbnb.com/help/article/887/what-are-airbnbs-rul... I ran into a situation where there was an undisclosed camera inside a room I rented (with the bathroom in its field of view, no less!). It put me in a tough spot because in an unfamiliar city, I don't want to cancel my room and have to l…

For this kind of offense if you are uncomfortable staying any longer, Airbnb can try to relocate you in a similar priced listing for the rest of your stay.

In any case you should also say so in the review so other guests are warned. The host can't see your review until after they review you themselves.

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#217

Post by okmokmz »

impendia wrote: post #192
terryf wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of the reasons I don't stay in airbnbs - the system breaks the social contract. The reason hotels are more expensive is because they have to follow a bunch of rules that makes everyone's life a bit better by having insurance for risks and zoning and so on. However you have to pay a bit more. So, if you ever find yourself complaining "I wish people did something in a not the absolute cheapest and effortles…

Personally, I find the "social contract" to be too biased in favor of homeowners. They control municipal governments and hence zoning laws. If these homeowners decide that they don't want to see visitors in their neighborhoods, they can decide they don't have to. So, in effect, this "contract" was unilaterally imposed by one party to it. I noticed this particularly in Princeton, NJ. A cute, small, and overly expensiv…

>Personally, I find the "social contract" to be too biased in favor of homeowners. They control municipal governments and hence zoning laws. If these homeowners decide that they don't want to see visitors in their neighborhoods, they can decide they don't have to. So, in effect, this "contract" was unilaterally imposed by one party to it.

Are you implying that tourists/visitors/non-locals should have as much say in local rules/policies/etc as the people that actually own property and live in those locations? If so I 100% disagree. While airbnbs are a less extreme example, look at tourist locations all around the world and how they are being destroyed and local populations are being displaced. The "social contract" SHOULD be biased in favor of people that actually live in and contribute to the area

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#218

Post by rodw »

hdpq wrote: post #148
JacKTrocinskI wrote: post #6

Or just go to a hotel! I have a condo in a building where most of the units are listed on Airbnb or Booking.com, quality of life for residents like me has been drastically reduced by noisy tourists that come for a weekend trip and have no regard for keeping it quiet or keeping the shared spaces clean. I hope more cities begin to ban Airbnb. Tourists belong in hotels not in buildings where families try to live their d…

Are hotels somehow immune to hidden cameras?

Of course not, but:

- Hotel rooms are more uniform (and just have less stuff) so a camera is easier to identify or harder to hide.

- Hotel rooms are visited not just by many guests but by many staff. If you place a camera you are sort of rolling the dice that no one that works in the hotel (and for example, cleans dozens of nearly identical rooms every day) is going to notice or won't care if they do notice.

- Hotels usually have management that cares about their reputation and hence would take direct and indirect measures to prevent someone from placing a camera in one of the rooms (e.g., scrutiny when hiring, limiting access to rooms, acting swiftly and severely when anything like this happens). (AirBnB does not seem to be interested in this sort of policing in particular.)

- Many hotels are part of a large chain, which does everything that individual managers do but on a larger and more systematic scale.

- It is almost certainly a crime to place an undisclosed camera in a hotel room (while inside someone's AirBnB it may be more of a gray area). This is both a deterrent and (by removing such people from the employee pool) a mitigation strategy.

- Beyond being a crime, hotel management and hotel chains are probably subject to lawsuits in the event one of their employees (or an outsider for that matter) successfully plants a camera in one of their rooms. This is also a deterrent and mitigation strategy.

I don't really have anything against AirBnB (in moderation) but I do think it is reasonable to assert that an AirBnB room is more likely to contain hidden cameras than the typical reputable hotel room.

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#219

Post by ppseafield »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #170
SenHeng wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The exception should not make the rule. Your example is one of the few edge cases where AirBnB works. The OP is talking about an everyday situation where AirBnB has instead had a detrimental effect on residents as well as would-be residents.

This is the type of NIMBYism that is contributing to the housing policy problems. Instead of using nuance and recognizing the good and bad, only the bad is focused on and the proposals are to throw it all out.

Generally NIMBYism involves push-back on policies that increase housing density to help more (and generally poorer) people live somewhere. AirBNB without regulation (and enforcement) doesn't help more people live in an area - in fact it removes long term residences from the market in favor of generating more revenue for existing property owners. Reducing the long term housing supply increases demand and prices, thus keeping poorer folks out.

Personally I don't mind AirBNB if it's only people renting out rooms in their residences. For instance here in Portland the law requires this. But it's poorly enforced.

Re: How to Find Hidden Cameras in Your Airbnb

#220

Post by okmokmz »

ryanmarsh wrote: post #191
terryf wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of the reasons I don't stay in airbnbs - the system breaks the social contract. The reason hotels are more expensive is because they have to follow a bunch of rules that makes everyone's life a bit better by having insurance for risks and zoning and so on. However you have to pay a bit more. So, if you ever find yourself complaining "I wish people did something in a not the absolute cheapest and effortles…

> I don't stay in airbnbs - the system breaks the social contract. I didn't know I was party to this contract, and I couldn't tell you what the terms are. I travel a lot for work and I stay almost exclusively in AirBnb because I like having my money and a nice home-like experience. I still don't understand how society would benefit from AirBnb not existing and us being where we started with the hotel cabal.

>I still don't understand how society would benefit from AirBnb not existing and us being where we started with the hotel cabal.

Many of the people on this site don't see or experience the downsides, as we are privileged enough to own our own properties or have our own space not impacted by airbnb. However, consider for example a family living in inexpensive housing with parents that work and children that are in school. There have been many cases of wealthy individuals purchasing/renting blocks of cheap apartments/condos and turning them into defacto hotels with no rules leading to partying, destruction of property, increased crime, and other issues. How would you feel if where you lived was suddenly overrun with short term tenants that are having a negative impact on your way of life, and not being able to afford to move?

That is how society would benefit form AIrbnb not existing. It may not benefit engineers making 100k+, but it would positively impact many in lower socioeconomic classes

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/26/reader-center/airbnb-new-...

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/sep/17/airbnb-nu...

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/airbnb-affordable-housing-gen...

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