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How to parent more predictably (2018)

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Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#211

Post by pbhjpbhj »

bartimus wrote: post #57
zubspace wrote: post #9

There are a few things which helped me get better at parenting: * Timeouts rarely work. Try to respond with something which makes sense. Like if your kid throws around things, they need to clean up (with your help). * If things get out of hand, I stay with or hold my kid until the situation gets better and then discuss/explain the current situation and how we will act next time. * It's always good to figure out how y…

Also: * Better to maintain a "allowed list" VS an "off-limits list" when setting boundaries. 1) The latter is simply not doable and everything you missed legitimately becomes allowed. 2) When in doubt your kid can come to you and ask if something is on the allowed list (something that doesn't make sense with an off-limits list). * Try not to say "no!". Approach things positively. Better to ask "What are seats made fo…

Why not colour the walls, why does your design aesthetic trump mine?

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#212

Post by pbhjpbhj »

tptacek wrote: post #202
zubspace wrote: post #9

There are a few things which helped me get better at parenting: * Timeouts rarely work. Try to respond with something which makes sense. Like if your kid throws around things, they need to clean up (with your help). * If things get out of hand, I stay with or hold my kid until the situation gets better and then discuss/explain the current situation and how we will act next time. * It's always good to figure out how y…

Timeouts worked great for us; the trick we found was just to be deterministic about them. We gave our kids a countdown warning and then invariably applied the same consequences when the countdown expired. After a couple applications of a 3-2-1 countdown followed by a timeout, our kids reliably responded by "2". The other observation I made was that it doesn't take much of a consequence at all to make this work. My in…

>the point is to avoid the power struggle. //

One of the children in my care always pushes the issue to a power struggle, regardless of how much one seeks to avoid it. They're very clever and try to manipulate the situation to apportion blame to the care-giver when it should rest with themselves. Frustrating and impressive in equal measure.

We scale timeouts according to age, 1min per year. Truly longer timeouts (for us) just result in punishment then ending up focusing on the timeout and the subject's failure to abide by the rules of timeout; which causes escalation.

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#213

Post by m0zg »

ianmcgowan wrote: post #207
m0zg wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You also have to recognize that kids are different. My son, for instance, will not clean up unless threatened with punishment (taking games away, stuff like that, not paddlin'). The textbook stuff doesn't work at all. Won't do homework, won't shower, won't brush his teeth, not to mention cleaning up his room (unless I threaten to throw his shit out; mom is too chicken to enforce anything).

We had a once-a-week cleanup rule when the kids were little. We all cleaned up the house for the weekend, kids just had to pickup their rooms. When they didn't (as is perfectly normal, pushing boundaries), I would tidy up by throwing everything into a big garbage bad and putting it up high in the garage (sort of a timeout for their belongings). Set a timer at the start of the process so they have a chance to do it th…

Yep, I've done a variation of that as well, to ensure compliance. One time a full garbage bag full of toys got thrown out.

But the meta-point is: kids are all different. Parenting advice happens to be mostly written by people whose children are already pretty well behaved and don't need much (if any) correction. These people think that they're really great at parenting, but in all likelihood the larger reason is that their children aren't shitheads to begin with. Not everyone is lucky like that, and humans are _very_ hard to debug. This is particularly annoying if the parent wasn't a shithead him/herself: there's this implicit assumption that the kids will be just like parents, but there's no guarantee whatsoever that it'll turn out like that.

In fact anecdotal evidence from my friends would suggest that very few people are "lucky". Only two kids (out of something like 30 in my circle) are what I'd call "good kids". One is a really smart girl (good at math, plays chess, in general just tends to do what's good for herself), and another kid has mild Asperger's, so he's in his own world: does super well in the accelerated program in school, knows how to code, but doesn't know how to interact with people, at all, and has no friends, or desire to have friends.

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#214

Post by pbhjpbhj »

totalrobe wrote: post #66
zubspace wrote: post #9

There are a few things which helped me get better at parenting: * Timeouts rarely work. Try to respond with something which makes sense. Like if your kid throws around things, they need to clean up (with your help). * If things get out of hand, I stay with or hold my kid until the situation gets better and then discuss/explain the current situation and how we will act next time. * It's always good to figure out how y…

>* Timeouts rarely work. This is entirely opposite of my experience. We do timeouts for harmful things (like hitting newborn baby brother, running into the street) or if he is having a tantrum and isn't cooling down. We didn't try timeouts until we read https://www.amazon.com/Happiest-Toddler-Block-Cooperative-Fo... , but we do use them now and they seem to be one of the few things that have a lasting effect on my to…

Some kids are distraught when separated from the family, others are quite content. IME timeout can be far more emotionally damaging than smacking. A well timed smack is a punishment for action; a "timeout" appears to be a desire for separation originating with the little-person's most loved-ones. A short-cut to the brain telling it that a behaviour is unwanted (smack) vs. an emotionally loaded action telling them [seemingly] their loved ones don't want them around.

I've smacked and ended self-destructive behaviour immediately and permanently (with ongoing reinforcement); done timeout and simply made a child distraught and supremely insecure.

Horses for courses, as they say. [That is, people vary and what works for one person will not work for another.]

Slight aside, isn't all correction for "harmful things" just at different levels of harm? I don't for example correct my children's "poor manners" in putting their elbows on the table because I don't consider it harmful in any substantial way; presumably my parents found it harmful enough to chastise me over otherwise why would they do so. My presumption is that they felt I'd be somewhat excluded by polite society for failing to adopt societal norms of table manners.

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#215

Post by [deleted] »

fma wrote: post #102
zubspace wrote: post #9

There are a few things which helped me get better at parenting: * Timeouts rarely work. Try to respond with something which makes sense. Like if your kid throws around things, they need to clean up (with your help). * If things get out of hand, I stay with or hold my kid until the situation gets better and then discuss/explain the current situation and how we will act next time. * It's always good to figure out how y…

A lot of what you've described is covered in detail in the book: "Peaceful Parent, Happy Kids: How to Stop Yelling and Start Connecting" I have not used YouTube yet for parenting but I would imagine it's a great resource. That book is kinda lengthy but I think YouTube, podcast is easy to consume for busy parents. I haven't finished that book yet and I got it a few months ago grin .

[deleted]

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#216

Post by pbhjpbhj »

lubujackson wrote: post #126
totalrobe wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>* Timeouts rarely work. This is entirely opposite of my experience. We do timeouts for harmful things (like hitting newborn baby brother, running into the street) or if he is having a tantrum and isn't cooling down. We didn't try timeouts until we read https://www.amazon.com/Happiest-Toddler-Block-Cooperative-Fo... , but we do use them now and they seem to be one of the few things that have a lasting effect on my to…

We have had great success with positive parenting (I think there is a book of that same name). Instead of timeouts we focus on calming and identifying emotions. It is empowering for children to be able to self-identity overwhelming emotions and handle them appropriately, which is a skill more adults would learn as well (myself included!) Simple tricks are to tie physical actions to images to help them calm down. "Sme…

Presumably they're now in school and have bitten, hit, scratched, pushed, or otherwise physically harmed others (most kids do particularly in the transition from parallel to cooperative play; greed is a very strong instinct). What's your spin on that? You just suggest that the child removes themselves if they feel like it?

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#217

Post by pbhjpbhj »

bcrosby95 wrote: post #136
totalrobe wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>* Timeouts rarely work. This is entirely opposite of my experience. We do timeouts for harmful things (like hitting newborn baby brother, running into the street) or if he is having a tantrum and isn't cooling down. We didn't try timeouts until we read https://www.amazon.com/Happiest-Toddler-Block-Cooperative-Fo... , but we do use them now and they seem to be one of the few things that have a lasting effect on my to…

> like hitting newborn baby brother We ran into this problem. Our oldest would just hit him again 5 minutes after the timeout. It got to the point where she would hit him, say "timeout!" and go to her timeout spot. She hated the timeout (she cried during it), but she decided it was worth it. She basically took every chance she could to hurt him. If she was walking by him, she would purposefully step on his fingers. O…

>We tried pretty much everything //

Did you smack her?

Worked first time to stop a child running on to the road for me, never needed to repeat it. Other kids in my care have learnt without that necessity, thankfully.

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#218

Post by pbhjpbhj »

ptah wrote: post #24
zubspace wrote: post #9

There are a few things which helped me get better at parenting: * Timeouts rarely work. Try to respond with something which makes sense. Like if your kid throws around things, they need to clean up (with your help). * If things get out of hand, I stay with or hold my kid until the situation gets better and then discuss/explain the current situation and how we will act next time. * It's always good to figure out how y…

timeouts work better if you call it naughty step instead. i've seen a few supernanny episodes where parents used timeouts before and it didn't work, and then she introduced naughty step and it works a charm

I just call it "the step". It's not always clear when a child is sent to "the step" whether they're guilty yet.

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#219

Post by pbhjpbhj »

throwaway713 wrote: post #59
Ma8ee wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m one of those parents that “don’t punish”. I do tell my child when he makes me angry or sad, and of course it is clear to him that I might not want to, say, play or read to him at that point. I still wouldn’t call that punishing him, but rather a consequence of his actions.

> I still wouldn’t call that punishing him, but rather a consequence of his actions. Weird aside, but sometimes when my wife and I have a conflict, I may go for a walk to clear my head, and I’m typically not interested in being intimate for a while after the conflict. She refers to this as "punishment", which seems like an odd way to describe me needing some space for a bit.

Wouldn't you class withdrawal of affection as punishment?

In psych terms it's a negative punishment (something was removed to seeks to reduce a behaviour). Your motivation might be different but the felt action is identical.

Re: How to parent more predictably (2018)

#220

Post by chrishas35 »

wahern wrote: post #171
ip26 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there something fundamentally wrong with rushing towards them & elevating your voice? It's not an emergency per se, but when our toddler stands up & teeters unwittingly towards the edge of our bed, or ventures to stairs unallowed, or almost snares a knife or hot mug on the counter, etc, it seems appropriate. Those circumstances are of course best avoided ahead of time but no one is perfect.

When my little boy was a toddler (maybe 1.5?) he was curious about a pot of water I was boiling. I was holding him and he leaned over to put his finger in it. My first reaction was to pull him away and shout, "No". Instead I decided to calmly explain to him that it was hot and he shouldn't touch it. He still wanted to put his finger in it. Well, it wasn't yet boiling and I was holding him and could pull him away, so…

One of the phrases I picked up watching younger family members be raised that I've tried to apply, when appropriate, as a parent: "They'll only do it once." Learning the why behind the "no" is an important of life. Obviously not every life lesson where "no" applies can be taught in this manner, but when it can be controlled...as the hot water was...it's an effective tool.
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