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The 3dfx Voodoo1

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211–220 of 241 posts

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As manufacturers continue to make increasingly questionable design choices, it's natural that users will become hesitant. You can get a possibly not-that-much-faster system, at the risk of losing functionality that has worked for a long time. In the same timeframe, we went from a 200 MHz Pentium MMX to a 1 GHz Pentium 3. ...and most if not all of your existing hardware and software would continue to work unchanged, i…

> and most if not all of your existing hardware and software would continue to work unchanged It’s funny how backwards compatibility back then allowed us to have massive progress, by making gradual steps forward possible. These days, where we are seeing less and less real progress, we now hear many programmers claiming we have to sacrifice and shed backwards compatibility if we want further progress. (I’m looking at…

I think this is partly because things have gotten vastly more complex & abstract, and none of that complexity and abstraction has been managed well. We basically always say "Yes right away" to increased complexity/abstraction these days when PM wants something.

Tech debt was lower back then.. maybe all of our practices were worse, but the code bases were thousands of times smaller which made up for a lot.

Heck Agile hadn't been invented yet back then. You got requirements and got to design the core technology first. There was no such thing as an MVP hack and all of a sudden you had a back end that had millions of lines of code and 10 layers of abstraction that was all built on a bad design.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#212
post #183
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with PC speaker vs SoundBlaster.

I think the equivalent of the Voodoo in the soundcards-space would've been the Gravis Ultrasound. In both the evolutionary and soon-to-be-forgotten sense. PC Speaker vs. Soundblaster is more EGA vs VGA, something much more profound. And beneficiary to the gaming space, as opposed to early 3D, which basically ruined all the things for quite a while...

Not even close. PC Speaker vs Soundblaster is Hercules (monochrome) vs VGA. You could never go back, same as 3dfx.

GUS was better than sb pro/sb 16 but a lot of games didn't take advantage of it and once AWE32/64 arrived, GUS was dead in the water.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#213
post #161

I collect vintage electronics, mostly computers and gaming consoles. The Voodoo cards are considered quite collectable because of their GLIDE API. There is a decent stack of games that will ONLY run on Voodoo cards, or will only support Voodoo natively, which matters to a lot of collectors. Back then, a good eye could sometimes identify a card just by looking at the game. For one, for a brief period, games were only…

They are already collector's items? :-/ For quite some time i wanted to buy one to play around with Glide (on a real machine) but i postponed it since it also requires building a full desktop and i do not have space at my current place :-P.

Perhaps i should try and find a couple of those before they disappear.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#214
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with PC speaker vs SoundBlaster.

If you only had or experienced IBM-compatible PCs. If you started on a Commodore or Amiga, the PC speaker to Sound Blaster/Adlib shift was more akin to just catching up. I wasn't completely happy until the 486 era because of this. The Voodoo1 4MB which I had back then as well, was unprecedented. I agree that the Sound Blaster was great (in isolation against older x86 PCs), but 3dfx was the first standout example of t…

The first standout example was VGA and games that fully took advantage of it. I was an Amiga user but AGA was too little too late and architecturally a disaster for certain games (DOOM, Quake). Even games like Monkey Island and Indiana Jones were a lot better on VGA than Amiga.

The game that did it for me was Privateer vs Elite II. I had to get a PC after I saw it. It was crystal clear the Amiga could not compete.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#215

When I first saw 3dfx graphics, I knew it was the dawn of a new era. I bought thousands of dollars in stock in the company. I lost it all because unfortunately nVidia ate their lunch because they marketed themselves better. They had full 32-bit color vs 3dfx who had the superior technology but only had 16 or 24 bit color. 3DFX spent a lot of time trying to explain why it didn't matter but in the end it did. It matter…

It wasnt 32bit color that made Nvidia emerge the winner. It was relentless push forward and an army of EEs working around the clock. On all accounts Nvidias first product should of been their last, supporting wrong paradigm, wrong specs, total fail. Yet somehow VCs allowed them a second try. After that it was just a straight dog race.

Riva 128 (April 1997) to TNT (June 15, 1998) took 14 months, TNT2 (March 15, 1999) 8 month, GF256 (October 11, 1999) 7 months, GF2 (April 26, 2000) 6 months, | 3dfx dies here |, GF3 (February 27, 2001) 9 months, GF4 (February 6, 2002) 12 months, FX (March 2003) 13 months, etc ...

Just think about it, 6 months between GPU generations, Nvidia had an army working 24/7 while 3dfx had couple ASIC people, 3dfx was murdered in their sleep.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#216
post #149
post #62

Ahh man I remember GL quake dropping and before the voodoo, or Riva 128 I had the ... Matrox Mystique 4mb!!! Was amazed and also sorely dissatisfied. Thus began the video card race/upgrade journey. Voodoo, Riva 128, tnt, voodoo2, lol don’t forget that power VR, what an amazing time to live

That PowerVR card - was it the Kyro or Kyro 2 or is there another one?

PCX was first http://vintage3d.org/pcx1.php

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#217
This brings back the memory. I was working for a tiny company in Taiwan at that time. We had been producing VGA cards for a while at that time. An IC distributor brought us a demo board of Voodoo 3D (V1) card. I ran the demo and told my boss that it was the best 3D graphic that I have ever seen. My boss just decided to run with it. Back in those days, VGA card vendor standard practice was to modify the reference in two way. 1. Modify the layout so it can accommodate many different memory chips. If your board can use cheaper memory chip, you will have better profit ( often mean chip which did meet standard memory testing, but still usable with some effort in layout and hardware design) 2. Modify the driver so you have a better benchmark score.

Since we were a tiny company with not many resources so we decided to just manufacture the reference design. This decision enables us to be the first one in Taiwan to ship the product. I cold call 50 companies in Europe. I did not have much success at first since distributors in Europe were not convinced that 3D card can sell. Internet was slow back then, we were still using dialup modem and sending video capture was not an option. I finally got a break when I called the 42nd company on the list: Guillemot (France). Guillemot got their start in PC gaming sound card so they were already interested in the 3D card. Guillemot was talking to Orchid Technology but they need a lower price than what Orchid can offer. Since all other Taiwanese makers were still evaluating or in the development process, we got the business because our price is US$50 lower than Orchid and able to ship right away.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#218
post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've a CPU from 2013 - a Haswell, and I was going to upgrade last year until I realized the performance increase wouldn't justify the price at all. Thinking back to a decade earlier and you'd wait 2 years to upgrade your CPU and it'd be a significant increase. Weird times.

It wasn't until consumer 8 core / 16 thread chips started entering mainstream that I even started thinking about upgrading. And even then its generally meh with how much software is single thread bottlenecked. Meltdown and spectre didn't help things - after they were published I definitely intended to wait for architectures mitigating them before upgrading again. Heres hoping AMD can keep pushing the envelope this ye…

Yeah, I'm holding out for AMD to do something big. At the moment I don't do anything that justifies a ton of cores - my home PC is a gaming machine, and that still likes a couple of fast cores than a bunch of smaller ones.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#219
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've definitely considered that thought over the years, again and again. I do think there truth to it and plays some role here, but overall would respectfully disagree with it as a flat out conclusion if used as a dismissal in this case. It's worth expanding on because you're not just wrong outright, it's impossible to objectively state that nostalgia isn't a factor, but I truly do think I'm onto something here on wi…

> Things are objectively worse today from the 20th century, everyone knows it or can definitely feel it. That may be true in the US (although of course it's debatable). In the global scale however, things have improved tremendously. For example, my region, Central and Eastern Europe, has been freed from comunism and flourished for the most part after 1989. But that's small change compared to vast improvements in livi…

Indeed. My point of view is fixated on a working-class perspective from the USA. I wouldn't say things here feel like hell, it's just more effort and people aren't used to studying or instilling discipline in their children so they can get up to par. There's no more jobs where you have no advanced education or specific skillset, where you walk in and walk out buying a house, motorcycle and 2 cars. People aren't used to not having that available. I've spent most of my career trying to be skills-based to not fall out of the middle class here. It's no longer easy, and it was felt after 9/11 and definitely after 2008.

I certainly dislike the shift of money out of the US (and western Europe, which is really in the same boat as we are), but tough to wish poverty, dismay or anything of the sort on the rest of the world.

In my career so far, I've worked with many people from Bulgaria, along with India. Really enjoyed the experience to be honest. I'm a best-person-for-the-job sort of guy (a concept that is actually falling by the wayside in the increasingly job-strapped USA in favor of nepotism and cronyism), and don't fret over macro-economic issues that I don't control. Just do my best to survive in the environment I was born in like everyone else.

I wouldn't say everyone is getting a great deal out of the US's economic system eating its own people, plenty of the world is being ignored outright. Eastern Europe and Asia are definitely some hotspots gaining though. I think global scale might be a stretch. But I could be wrong, just thinking about the parts of the world where capitalists aren't investing as much.

I love talking to folks from Bulgaria and such about their lives from the Soviet era till today. One told me that "we didn't have much, but you didn't care or notice because everyone else was". Lack of envy etc, that individual was actually admiring his previous life in ways, which I understand given how miserable so many people appear today..

Very interesting perspectives on life and the world, to me at least. I also enjoy teams with folks from India, usually upbeat and smiling and that's (almost) all I ask for. I also suspect working with developers in Latin America would be a similar experience. The culture differences get a little abrasive though once you move out of India into the rest of Asia.

Re: The 3dfx Voodoo1

#220
post #161

I collect vintage electronics, mostly computers and gaming consoles. The Voodoo cards are considered quite collectable because of their GLIDE API. There is a decent stack of games that will ONLY run on Voodoo cards, or will only support Voodoo natively, which matters to a lot of collectors. Back then, a good eye could sometimes identify a card just by looking at the game. For one, for a brief period, games were only…

The Voodoo cards had that odd glossy, liquid look that made the surfaces of objects seem deeply physical. The ADCs (EDIT: RAMDACs, of course) that they were using did an odd sort of "poor man's antialiasing" and running any games from that era on modern equipment is a shocking exercise in explicitly defined pixels.
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