From my understanding, just because these devices are always listening, doesn't mean they are always recording. Only when you say the wake word do they start recording and only that information is used for advertising/etc.
Right??
Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
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Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#212Assuming they didn't do that already, a couple more mics in the device base with noise cancelling circuitry if implemented the analog way or in software will defeat this project in no time.
I applaud the intent, but unless one knows for sure how many mics are there, including tiny MEMS devices like accelerometers that can be used as such, and can physically disconnect them all, there's no way to know the device isn't listening.
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not that this helps anyone sleep easier, but imagine in today's age... a whistleblower -- perhaps one of the thousands of software devs working on one of these -- leaked proof that these devices are recording everything to re-market and profit, without permission... The resulting backlash and legal ramifications would be so huge it just wouldn't be worth it. It wouldn't just take an insane and stupid CEO to do that,…
Surely somebody in the '90s said something similar with regard to location data, and yet your location is tracked 24/7 by adtech megacorps, and the thousands of tech/adops employees don't say a peep. The playbook has 3 easy steps: 1. Get people addicted to technology X. 2. Keep bugging people using technology X to surrender their privacy using classical dark patterns. 3. Profit! There is no need for whistleblowers. I…
> Surely somebody in the '90s said something similar with regard to location data, and yet your location is tracked 24/7
I remember a Romanian politician and member of Parliament complaining about the local telecom providers displaying the GSM location data on the phones’ screens sometime back in 2002 and 2003, I remember of laughing at his ludicrous (that’s how I viewed it at the time) complaint, I mean, he was a stupid politician while I was a CS student, couldn’t he see how cool it was to see your neighborhood name on your Nokia 3110’s screen? Of course that the stupid politician was right and I and the fellow technophiles like myself were wrong.
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#214Or just don't buy one in order to hack it and instead start with a project that supports these goals at its core. https://mycroft.ai/
Does it allow you to change the name you call it now?
Last time I looked at it, the dev wanted to know how much I was ready to pay for the feature...
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#215From my understanding, just because these devices are always listening, doesn't mean they are always recording. Only when you say the wake word do they start recording and only that information is used for advertising/etc. Right??
It’s a closed source device with an always on internet connection and it silently accepts software updates. So... maybe? Certainly that is how they are marketed. But is that really how they behave? Does the software accept a command that would have it send back additional data on command? Could we know?
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm probably biased because I lived my early childhood behind the Iron Curtain but I can't for the life of me understand why someone would buy these. The cost-benefit is just not there.
Huh. I came to the opposite conclusion - growing up in Eastern Europe, "they're always listening" is the default position for me, so one more listening device is no big deal.
That's why I was never surprised by the Facebook 'revelations' and stuff. But that doesn't enable me to make their surveillance easier, tovarase!
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
The entire top surface of the Google Home is a button (capacitive). Those kinds of sensors are just as susceptible to physical defects as mechanical buttons. As a side note, whataboutism adds nothing of value to this discussion about the Google Home and Amazon Echo.
And the capacitive button doesn't trigger the listening hardware. Splitting hairs over the hardware specifications isn't proof that the bug is still a problem. Also, talking about your contradictory behavior with your smartphone isn't whataboutism, unless you want to avoid addressing your hypocrisy, because smart phones are susceptible to the same blanket fears you have with homes/alexa. To critique only the latter,…
> And the capacitive button doesn't trigger the listening hardware.
Per Google's own site: "Long press to trigger the Google Assistant."
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are you sure that gets what you want? Our desires for my kids might be different. Sounds like you think kids should be punished until they learn who is the boss. I'm not sure you have read all the literature on the effectiveness of that strategy. I never said I want my two year old to know the Google brand. She hears her older siblings saying it. It is just what is so with her. But guess what? I'm willing to wager my…
Sorry, my apologies. I misread your post read to mean that you were happy/excited to have your kid understand Google as a brand (i.e. valuable). As for parenting, we may just agree to disagree. I concur with your assessment that siblings will definitely teach more than parents. That's to be expected. We just would never reward bad behaviour with acquiescence. But to each his own. Our seven-year old has wide latitude…
I actually think we agree on more than we disagree.
Totally align with not giving in to screaming and yelling, and I'm consistent (or at least aware) about that, but when my youngest is sick and just went down for a nap, well...
Those are good points you make and I'll hope to recall those techniques with my just turned six year old. As you say, building valuable life skills.
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Because it's a literal hardware limitation. The device is built in a way that requires a wake word before any recording can possibly happen [...] Take note that Amazon Drop In [1] is a feature built around turning on the Echo mic remotely without a wake word. I don't think this feature could exist if there was a hardware limitation. [1] https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=...
But doesn't the device light up when that happens?
And it beeps, and the audio from the other end starts coming through the echo's speaker. There is just about no way to know someone dropped in on you.
Re: Project Alias hacks Amazon Echo and Google Home to protect privacy
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
> (they aren’t) How do you know? And, how do you know they will not do this silently in the future? Also worse detection does not mean more false positives. Usually, you can get the false positive rate very low by allowing more false negatives. In this way you have a choice, how you want to trade-off. Without this device, you are stuck with the choice that Amazon/Google make for you.
> How do you know? And, how do you know they will not do this silently in the future? Because it's a literal hardware limitation. The device is built in a way that requires a wake word before any recording can possibly happen, thanks to it being built with 2 separate control boards. If they ended up maybe changing the wakeword to "the", then maybe they could "silently" listen to everything, but that would be caught p…
> Packet sniffing
The unauthorized recorded data can be sent encoded with/into the authorized data.