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We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

news.nationalgeographic.com

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Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#211

Post by cmurf »

wycklendt14 wrote: post #202
joekrill wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No offense to you personally, but it's kind of disconcerting that this is the top comment. You've outright admitted to only having "used to run a bit" -- and not very much, at that. But then go on to promote barefoot running as if you're somehow a fully qualified expert who knows enough to talk on the matter and declare barefoot running is _clearly_ the answer. I'm not saying you're wrong or right. This shoed/barefoo…

I agree with you that there is no proof that barefoot running is better for you, but the problem is there is no proof that cushioned shoes are better for you either... I have been a minimalist/barefoot runner for 4 years and have run a 50 mile ultramarathon and am currently training for 100 mile ultramarathon. I am constantly asked how/why I do it and the best answer that I can come up with is because I like the way…

All the people I know in their 60's 70's still running are doing like 2-5 miles per day maximum. Few ran marathons more than casually. All of them wear shoes. But all of them had to iterate a lot to find shoes that work for them.

Running two marathons per week strikes me as way beyond excessive, if the goal is just to be running later in life.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#212

Post by Shikadi »

kiriakasis wrote: post #143
sgk284 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your heel doesn't have leverage to lift your body off of the ground. If your heel is leaving the ground it's either your knee lifting it or your toes pushing it. In the gif you linked, and in proper running form, you push with the balls of your feet. Your ankle / heel system is solely a fulcrum that doubles as a dampening spring.

"pushing" isn't the only way to apply force. from the gif the ball of the feet start and end the "pushing", but this is unrelated to how much lifting you do with the heel

It looks to me like you're ignoring inertia, the force is highest right when you switch between catching yourself and pushing off

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#213

Post by WalterSear »

J_Sherz wrote: post #176
JauntyHatAngle wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I second this. I've always wore "normal" joggers, been running, playing sport etc without a problem for decades. Swapped to minimalist shoes, and bam, had shin splints for months, I assumed it was the amount I was running for a while before I realised it was just the shoes and their lack of support. Went back to my normal shoes and got insole supports for my new shoes, the shin splints went away very quickly. Turns o…

I have had a similar experience, but am still trying to find the right balance. I'm a little heavier than the average runner and was getting shin splints in regular running shoes on the "back side" of my leg. Switched to barefoot shoes (and probably didn't build up slowly enough) and had Achilles tendon issues. It fixed the shin splint problem for a while, but then they reappeared, this time on the front side of the…

As I've mentioned elsewhere, did you change your running style at all? Shin splints suggest heel striking. Barefoot running feels a bit like running backwards compared to regular running - it's not the same motion at all.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#214

Post by WalterSear »

sillysaurus3 wrote: post #55
rosser wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, "pushing off with your heel" is not a thing. It's imprecise language, to be sure. I think it's more about where you're concentrating the force. If you look at the .gif that 'WalterSear shared down-thread, you'll see that the greatest force is just before the heel lifts, not after. That's the difference, I think, between "pushing off" with the heel or the forefoot: where, specifically, in the stride the maximu…

So can anyone sum up what the right way to run is?

"Barefoot" or "Regular"?

They process is entirely different.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#215

Post by overcast »

joshmarlow wrote: post #187
notheguyouthink wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think we as humans really need to learn a line between medical treatments and help-your-self. Medicine is dolled out far too easily, when as you mentioned, activity that our body is meant to do is so much more effective. The simply things in life like exercise are so amazing for us. At work I have back problems, yet they completely go away as long as I keep my core in check. I did this by simply buying a pull up ba…

I'll add my own anecdote here. I'd been having arm/shoulder aches for several years due to typing/mousing and when I started indoor rock climbing, it basically entirely disappeared. I'm assuming stretching/strengthening other arm muscles is what addressed it.

I always tell people to do pushups. It's the simplest exercise to do just about anywhere with your height in floor space. I guarantee that will clear up 99% of your back issues, especially those from excess time spent in a computer chair. Every hour or so, get up, bang out 10-20 pushups. You'll be amazed.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#216

Post by zzalpha »

dahart wrote: post #197
simplyluke wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. The notion (expressed in the article) that most people don't require training to run correctly is patently false. Most people aren't even breathing correctly, the idea that you can pick up after decades in schools and sedentary jobs and start running miles with no input in a way that won't get you hurt is rather dangerous.

> Most people aren't even breathing correctly What's the correct way to breathe? Isn't not dying "correct"?

LOL, perhaps in its most basic form.

Do you breathe using your chest or your stomach? How deeply? At what cadence? Through your nose, or through your mouth?

All of these things really matter when learning to run comfortably.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#217

Post by overcast »

Raidion wrote: post #196
joekrill wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No offense to you personally, but it's kind of disconcerting that this is the top comment. You've outright admitted to only having "used to run a bit" -- and not very much, at that. But then go on to promote barefoot running as if you're somehow a fully qualified expert who knows enough to talk on the matter and declare barefoot running is _clearly_ the answer. I'm not saying you're wrong or right. This shoed/barefoo…

Maybe I can chime in here, I've been running competitively through HS, College, and some marathons after. Barefoot running is only revolutionary to some people because it correctly aligns the incentives to have proper form. If you're barefoot/vibram running with proper form, you'll pretty much instantly feel all this discomfort of the impacts in your heel, knee, and back. This discomfort doesn't exist when you're in…

I don't run often, but I hike a TON. 10+ mile hikes, 3-5 times a week, over moderate elevation changes. After three weeks at Yosemite in July a couple years ago, I've completely moved on from heavy hiking boots, to Inov8 trail shoes. Ultralight, 0-4mm drop. Best move I've ever made. Just did a week in the Canadian rockies, over HEAVY terrain, and rock scrambles. No more overheating, stronger feet, and I can go MUCH further distances.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#218

Post by throwanem »

magic_beans wrote: post #204
throwanem wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seconding long walks. It's easy! You just look around for something interesting, and let your feet carry you toward it - they know what to do, and they will if you let them. Repeat as necessary. When you start to run out of puff, look for interesting things nearer home than not. Stay away from roads and sidewalks, if you can. Trees give shade, and shade is cool and pleasant and helps you husband your energy for findi…

This was a really beautiful comment and I've favorited it to come back to. I wish I could run through the woods barefoot! If only I didn't live in city. But being able to move one's own body freely, unselfconsciously, and ensconced in nature.... one of life's greatest pleasure.

That's very kind of you to say - thank you!

It depends a lot on the city in which you happen to live. Baltimore, for example, has a great deal to offer in the department of bosque, bower, glade, and verge - this, for example, was yesterday evening, halfway up a very tall hill that happened to be part of my route home du jour: http://i.imgur.com/84Q2mxu.jpg

(That said, you wouldn't catch me barefoot in any woods around here - for all that I grew up that way, the woods back home are not noted for their likelihood of putting broken glass or old masonry underfoot, while those around here are full of such things.)

Barefoot or no, it's definitely worth making the opportunity, if there's a way you can do so! On the other hand, if there are no handy woods nearby, there's a great deal to be said for making the most of the environment you find to hand. No matter where you happen to be - there are wonders all around you, just waiting to be found.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#219

Post by nextos »

pg314 wrote: post #152
nextos wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aside from the form, I also wonder about the distance. Is it healthy to run long distances at a constant heartrate vs interval training? As described in an article linked in the one posted, humans seem to have evolved to run long distances [1]. I wonder how we could reconcile that with the fact that long distance running at constant pace seems to be bad for our hearts [2]. [1] http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/…

From the abstract: However, this concept is still hypothetical and there is some inconsistency in the reported findings. Furthermore, lifelong vigorous exercisers generally have low mortality rates and excellent functional capacity. I'll take low mortality and excellent functional capacity.

Sure, I'm not implying long distance running is unhealthy. I believe it is healthy, but there is some evidence some long distance running forms are unhealthy.

Thus, I wonder how that running humans hypothetically evolved with differs from what we practice as sport these days. Perhaps their pace was lower and broken into intervals.

Re: We Evolved to Run But We're Doing It Wrong

#220

Post by marcus_holmes »

westiseast wrote: post #186
joekrill wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No offense to you personally, but it's kind of disconcerting that this is the top comment. You've outright admitted to only having "used to run a bit" -- and not very much, at that. But then go on to promote barefoot running as if you're somehow a fully qualified expert who knows enough to talk on the matter and declare barefoot running is _clearly_ the answer. I'm not saying you're wrong or right. This shoed/barefoo…

I agree. Evidence out there seems to suggest that trainers are bad by overcushioning the feet or placing the body in a bad position, but... For example, I'm sure our neolithic ancestors ran long distances because they had to. There's nothing implicit in this about whether it's good for us, and we don't know how many of them got eaten or died because they had bum knees!

our neolithic ancestors also ran on grass/ forest floor, not asphalt or concrete.

I run in cities. I love my trainers.

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