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H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

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Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#211

Post by Termiux »

mtokunaga wrote: post #210

I am not sure if it is true still, but I remember "regular" workers in Japan do not have to file tax. They are deducted from their pays and that's it. I think that will similarly apply to a very large number of population. I also never liked really to use accountants, as they basically ask the same questions that I have to collect myself. Might as well use an online tool. Especially if most of the "W"s are already at…

This is how it's done in Mexico, most people have no idea how to declare taxes any other way. You can still deduct some things in an itemization like manner if you want or are self employed but otherwise its automatically deducted from your payroll.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#212

Post by ams6110 »

snarfy wrote: post #200
ams6110 wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taxes are easy for the average person. A basic 1040-A, and certainly 1040-EZ (these two cover most taxpayers), are not difficult to do on paper if you can read and have a little patience. I'm not defending Intuit here, by the way. But most people don't need what they are selling.

You cannot itemize a 1040.

True, you need the full 1040 return for that, but most people don't have enough deductions to itemize -- that was my point. The average tax return is a 1040A or 1040EZ with the standard deduction. Those are easy.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#213

Post by anigbrowl »

refurb wrote: post #165
anigbrowl wrote: post #130

They've been doing this for years. When I grumble about capitalism this is the sort of thing that annoys me. People say government is bad because it doesn't have competition and is a van intrinsically violent monopoly, but here we see an example of private actors spending money to make government unresponsive or outright antagonistic to people's needs so as to profit by serving those needs. The argument goes on that…

* When I grumble about capitalism this is the sort of thing that annoys me.* Is this a problem with capitalism or government? If a company tries to get the gov't to block competition, the correct response is "piss off".

I went on to address that i the rest of the comment.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#214

Post by zo1 »

Maarten88 wrote: post #99

In the Netherlands we have had this for years. You login with the tax agency and download a pre-filled tax form. Wages and Income Tax is pre-filled, as are Bank savings and morgages. The pre-filled form is complete for over 90% of people. The 10% for who it is not can add or correct things that our IRS may not know correctly (i.e. foreign holdings or bitcoins). You then digitally sign and submit it. It's quite easy t…

Same goes for here in South Africa. And that's coming from a country whose government is well known for its inept service and corruption. Most tax-related things, generally "90%" of them, can be done fully online without ever having to set foot in an official office, or speak to someone on the phone.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#216

Post by Jach »

mabbo wrote: post #52
atonse wrote: post #24

Could we not start a non-profit that builds software as good as H&R block and allows people to file their own taxes?

A lot of what H&R Block sells is experience in filing taxes, not just knowledge of how to do it. I have complex multi-country taxes to file (Canadian living in Canada, but with some income the IRS says is American income). H&R Block have a guy who has handled this exact kind of tax filing hundreds of times before. If I make any mis-steps in filing, the IRS is going to demand I give them thousands of dollars. I'm not…

After two years at two different H&R Blocks I'm not convinced in their expertise. Got an IRS letter demanding payment for some income the first guy said I didn't have to report, I paid to make it go away and it wasn't high enough that I felt like I needed to cause a ruckus with H&R Block. (Besides they'd probably just say I was the one who forgot to include it, not their fault.) The second time the lady assigned to me tried to shoo me away for the evening (because they charge on the final amount of forms they have to file, not the time) rather than wait (I waited) for someone else at the location who wasn't confused by the concept of RSUs to become available. It'll be TurboTax for me this year though I am tempted to do it manually and use the H&R Block forms prior as a template.

Still, my taxes were complicated for 2014 so I was glad for the help. I agree that's ultimately what their value is, along with their promise of assistance should things really go wrong, it's just not usually top-expert help and if it can be replaced by cheap software it should be, even if overall simplification is still the best outcome.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#217

Post by blackguardx »

jandrese wrote: post #183
blackguardx wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever actually done your taxes by hand? The 1040EZ is supposed to take 7 hours. Back when I did paper taxes and couldn't do the 1040EZ, the 1040 long form took me about 20 hours to do, slightly beating the IRS estimate of 22 hours. The government has all the information about me. Why do I have to gather it all up and tell them again? A friend in Finland tells me it takes him 10 minutes to approve the tax docu…

How the hell can it take 7 hours to fill out the 1040EZ. The only people who can use that form are the ones with super-simple tax situations. Literally a W2 and maybe a 1099 from your bank. You fill in a couple dozen fields or so and punch some numbers into your calculator and you're done. I can believe 7 hours for a 1040, because leafing through the 200 page instruction book is hugely time consuming and there is a l…

The IRS has to provide time estimates for every form they have. They even have to give you a notice that the paperwork complies with the "paperwork reduction act."

7 hours was the IRS estimate for the 1040EZ as of 2012. I understand it is down to 5 hours now. The 1040 long form is down to 18 hours. I don't do my taxes by hand anymore, though.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#218

Post by blackguardx »

senior_james wrote: post #161
blackguardx wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever actually done your taxes by hand? The 1040EZ is supposed to take 7 hours. Back when I did paper taxes and couldn't do the 1040EZ, the 1040 long form took me about 20 hours to do, slightly beating the IRS estimate of 22 hours. The government has all the information about me. Why do I have to gather it all up and tell them again? A friend in Finland tells me it takes him 10 minutes to approve the tax docu…

"The 1040EZ is supposed to take 7 hours" Huh? I've had my business for a few years, but I did my 1040EZ by hand many times. It took at most, 3 hours. Most people have one job and you basically just copy all of the info you have from your W2 (which is provided by your employer). "The government has all the information about me. Why do I have to gather it all up and tell them again?" So does the government also have al…

That was the IRS estimate in 2012.

Your arguments aren't compelling. Even 3 hours is too much. Most people take the standard deduction and don't itemize.

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#219

Post by [deleted] »

sp332 wrote: post #70
blackguardx wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you ever actually done your taxes by hand? The 1040EZ is supposed to take 7 hours. Back when I did paper taxes and couldn't do the 1040EZ, the 1040 long form took me about 20 hours to do, slightly beating the IRS estimate of 22 hours. The government has all the information about me. Why do I have to gather it all up and tell them again? A friend in Finland tells me it takes him 10 minutes to approve the tax docu…

The 1040EZ is a single page and has only 2 pages of instructions. How does it take 7 hours? http://datechguyblog.com/2011/04/15/7-hours-for-form-1040ez-... (Link from 2011 but I don't remember it being much different lately.) Edit: the IRS now says it takes 3 hours to fill out and submit the form, and 2 hours to collect the relevant paperwork, for 5 total. https://www.irs.gov/instructions/i1040gi/ar03.html

[deleted]

Re: H&R Block and Intuit Are Lobbying Against Making Tax Filling Free and Easy

#220

Post by John23832 »

jakelazaroff wrote: post #204
John23832 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a perfect society, everyone would act ethically. That isn't true sadly. We have to often force people to be ethical. We force businesses into ethics through law. We can't guilt trip a business. We can however expect ethics/morality from politicians because they are people. And really, they are elected into their positions because of their ethics.

> We can't guilt trip a business. Sure we can. We can complain to them, boycott them, post stories on HN so other people know they're unethical, etc. > We can however expect ethics/morality from politicians because they are people. Businesses are just groups of people. A business behaves ethically only if the people who make it up behave ethically. We don't lose the ability to criticize them just because they're acti…

> Sure we can. We can complain to them, boycott them, post stories on HN so other people know they're unethical, etc.

Sure, we could do that, but unless any of those things affect profit, the business won't change. Morality doesn't motivate business, profit/money does.

> Businesses are just groups of people. A business behaves ethically only if the people who make it up behave ethically. We don't lose the ability to criticize them just because they're acting as a group.

Sure, and if people feel morally conflicted an leave the business, they are replaced. If there comes a time where so many people are morally conflicted that there are not enough people to run effectively run the business, then the business will change or cease to exist. Even in that situation, you have a moral issue for the workers that became a financial issue for the business.

Businesses have no morals. The people who run it do.

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