Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

perpetual-beta.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

211–220 of 228 posts

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#211

Post by dkonofalski »

stickfigure wrote: post #91
hmigneron wrote: post #42

I'm always surprised when developers don't talk about the F keys in their reviews of the new MBP. I mostly agree with the author regarding the escape key, the touch bar isn't really a problem in that regard, it still works and I got used to "pressing" it on the touchbar really quickly. I really really miss physical F keys though. I spend a lot of time debugging (either in the Chrome debugger or in IDEs) where pressin…

Interesting that you mention this. I was tempted to buy a new MBP hoping that I could map the touchbar to debugger functions - I can never remember which F key is which. Little icons would be amazing. Is it not possible to make the touchbar work with IDEA? That would be a major disappointment.

It is. On top of that, there are apps and tools that let you customize just about everything.

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#212

Post by dkonofalski »

SomeHacker44 wrote: post #202
chadcmulligan wrote: post #115

I don't hear much about the display on the MBP, it's as near to perfect as any display I've ever seen, using text is beautiful, the colour depth is extraordinary - and its a laptop. I plugged in a new external 1080p monitor and thought at first there was something wrong with it, but no it's just the difference in crispness. Not only that you can run 2 external 5K monitors! from a laptop! The SSD's are so fast, it's a…

Your points are largely moot, IMO. Nearly any laptop you can buy has super quick NVMe SSDs, super quick CPUs, and even great monitors. Heck, my Alienware 13R3 has an OLED monitor that puts the 13" MBP TB that I have to total shame. Since everyone is running essentially commodity Intel hardware with commodity SSDs and commodity RAM and commodity GPUs with third-party sourced flat panels, the only thing that matters is…

Except that's your opinion... I love the Touch Bar and I love the new keyboard. It's no louder when I'm typing than it was when I was typing on my old Dell and yet I'm much faster on it since the keys don't wobble like they did on the Dell. The trackpad is awesome and I haven't been able to find the display that even comes close on any laptop without getting into the same price range.

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#213

Post by dkonofalski »

mattkevan wrote: post #84
contergan wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm inclined not to believe the 15 hour claim. I've had the 2015 MBP since it came out and get maybe 4-5 hours of battery life doing non-heavy web development nowadays. After I newly bought it I got maybe around 7 hours at most. With integrated graphics only of course - with the dedicated GPU active I get around 3 hours or so only.

Are you using Chrome or Electron apps? Chrome rinses mine in about 3-4 hours, whereas Safari lasts all day.

Same here. I didn't believe my friend when he told me it was Chrome and, for some reason, I didn't believe the battery meter that kept telling me that Chrome was using significant power. Switched to Safari and now my battery lasts all day. If I could get Slack to play nice I think I'd have over a day of charge (1 day meaning a 12-16 hour working day, not 24 hours).

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#214

Post by dkonofalski »

diego wrote: post #41

I really want to get one of these, but I can't get myself to. I have a 2015 Macbook and I hate the keyboard. I thought I'd get used to it but never did, the one in an older Air is so much more comfortable to me. I went to the Apple Store twice to try out the new keyboard and, while it's better, I can't imagine being happy with it. Does anyone else feel the same way or is it just me?

I didn't think I'd like the new keyboard but I was forced to use it as it's a work-supplied machine. After less than a month of using it, it's my favorite keyboard of any machine I own, including my mechanical keyboard. The travel is nice, the keys feel solid, it's got a nice click, and I can type faster. Took a bit of getting used to, but it's awesome, imo.

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#215

Post by chadcmulligan »

SomeHacker44 wrote: post #202
chadcmulligan wrote: post #115

I don't hear much about the display on the MBP, it's as near to perfect as any display I've ever seen, using text is beautiful, the colour depth is extraordinary - and its a laptop. I plugged in a new external 1080p monitor and thought at first there was something wrong with it, but no it's just the difference in crispness. Not only that you can run 2 external 5K monitors! from a laptop! The SSD's are so fast, it's a…

Your points are largely moot, IMO. Nearly any laptop you can buy has super quick NVMe SSDs, super quick CPUs, and even great monitors. Heck, my Alienware 13R3 has an OLED monitor that puts the 13" MBP TB that I have to total shame. Since everyone is running essentially commodity Intel hardware with commodity SSDs and commodity RAM and commodity GPUs with third-party sourced flat panels, the only thing that matters is…

While the alienware is a mighty machine, it's aesthetics and market are somewhat different. There are a number of feature points that differentiate it in my mind (weight, heat, elegance, glowing touchpad etc), I think we'll have to agree to disagree.

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#216

Post by rtpg »

routelastresort wrote: post #67
WildUtah wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a real detriment to UI, it costs you battery life, it's a distracting gimmick, and it adds $200 to the cost of your machine. And Apple will never give up on it. Every Mac is going to be worse for years and years because of it. Enjoy.

The good thing that can come of this would be the resurgence of the Linux desktop. Apple just crossed the line for me (<32GB, no SSD upgrade, messing with the keyboard). I'll miss the almost perfect trackpad, but there's no way I'll support these choices.

Even the XPS 13 (supposed to be built for Linux support) seems to have a lot of basic hardware/software problems.

I was looking for an excuse to get one recently but found enough testimony of breakage to not make the switch.

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#217

Post by gradstudent »

rtpg wrote: post #216
routelastresort wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The good thing that can come of this would be the resurgence of the Linux desktop. Apple just crossed the line for me (<32GB, no SSD upgrade, messing with the keyboard). I'll miss the almost perfect trackpad, but there's no way I'll support these choices.

Even the XPS 13 (supposed to be built for Linux support) seems to have a lot of basic hardware/software problems. I was looking for an excuse to get one recently but found enough testimony of breakage to not make the switch.

I tried to buy one of these recently. Dell won't sell them in my country. I looked Too bad I can't buy it with Linux (or nothing!) pre-installed.

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#218

Post by divergio »

chrisseaton wrote: post #191
apricot wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I play the piano and I never use the black keys, except C# once in a while.

That analogy is nonsensical. A pianist that doesn't use some keys is limited in the music they can produce. I can write exactly the same code as you without using shortcuts. I think the advantage is that I don't have to learn completely arbitrary lists of silly little keys to press, and I can keep my brain-space for useful things.

"and I can keep my brain-space for useful things"

Respectfully, the point of keyboard shortcuts is that they are remembered in your hands, not in your brain. This is the main reason most of these commenters reject the Touch Bar: lacking tactile feedback for button position, it seems like it would be difficult to develop "muscle memory" for a Touch Bar function key.

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#219

Post by eecc »

fludlight wrote: post #75
adiabatty wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect I'd use the touch bar in Notes where I frequently want to use title and header and normal formatting, but have trouble remembering the keyboard shortcuts for those three functions (I'm not in Notes much). In other apps, I don't know how much I'd use it.

That's the thing: the HN crowd is a small segment of their user base. For most people, Cmd-P might as well be C-x M-c M-butterfly. The touch bar doesn't replace the function keys but rather the mouse.

Hmm, there's a touch of contempt for the average user in what you say... something that causes this current trend towards over-simplification.

Users love clear, systematic, repeatable, stable. Anyone using a shortcut often enough, given enough time will learn to use it because anyone can appreciate the advantage.

People that hunt-and-peck, or click around like seniors in a retirement-home absolutely hate the hostile and cumbersome UI that is hiding all the usefulness behind gimmicks.

;)

Re: Thoughts on the Late 2016 MacBook Pro

#220

Post by RugnirViking »

jbverschoor wrote: post #120
hpaavola wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe that the fundamental issue can be fixed. Ironically "Touch Bar" is something you can't feel when you touch it. Real physical buttons guide your finger to the correct location if you miss them slightly. "Touch" buttons don't. To fix that, one would need to rework the whole OS and applications in such way that they don't use F-keys at all, but rather something else. So, fixing Touch Bar means rethinking…

Just wait until the force-touchbar and then the 3d-touchbar. I agree with the feedback, but I'm certain they will add this.

A 3d, force, touchbar sounds awfully like just a row of buttons to me ;-)
Post reply on HN