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Visual Studio for Mac

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Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#211

Post by coldtea »

jmkni wrote: post #156
adamlett wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you kidding me? How can you not see that this is nothing more than an arbitrary habit that you've grown comfortable with? Imagine the function keys had never existed to begin with. Don't you think we would have come up with a different way of stepping through code with a debugger? I understand that it's annoying to have to change your habits, but you're a developer for crying out loud: Your job is literally to ch…

Well...pretty much everything you do is an arbitrary habit that you've grown comfortable with . Sleeping in a bed is an arbitrary habit that you've grown comfortable with , why not sleep on the floor, or in the bath? The fact is that when developing and debugging, the function keys represent the most efficient way of stepping through code, and a part of this is to do with their physical presence on the keyboard. I kn…

>Sleeping in a bed is an arbitrary habit that you've grown comfortable with, why not sleep on the floor, or in the bath?

Because your back will hurt, so not that arbitrary after all.

You will have no adverse effects of using an alternate method to step in the debugger.

>The fact is that when developing and debugging, the function keys represent the most efficient way of stepping through code

Citation needed. They are at best a random accident. Any other keys or key combos could be used.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#212

Post by tracker1 »

0x0 wrote: post #47
Kipters wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think so, it's still a MonoDevelop fork

Ah ok. So now there are three (four?) completely different products branded as "Visual Studio"? 1. The original, real Visual Studio for Windows, 2. Visual Studio Code (a fork of atom?), 3. Visual Studio for Mac, (4. Visual Studio Express?)

VS Code uses electron, but is not a fork of atom... It's actually very fast and fairly nice.. the ui started similar to atom, though I wish I could take back my request for tabs support and go back to the non tabs ui.

This Mac version is a rebadge of Xamerin Studio, with some redesign and tooling improvements.

VS Express is really a stripped down version of VS, and the community edition is usually a better option.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#213

Post by coldtea »

pschastain wrote: post #168
adamlett wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you kidding me? How can you not see that this is nothing more than an arbitrary habit that you've grown comfortable with? Imagine the function keys had never existed to begin with. Don't you think we would have come up with a different way of stepping through code with a debugger? I understand that it's annoying to have to change your habits, but you're a developer for crying out loud: Your job is literally to ch…

> an arbitrary habit that you've grown comfortable with You mean a workflow? Who are you (or anyone else) to decide what works best for me? Am I not capable of making my own decisions? Do I really need a hardware company making those choices for me?

>Who are you (or anyone else) to decide what works best for me? Am I not capable of making my own decisions?

Most people aren't -- from politics to personal finances and relationships, there are tons of bad decisions everywhere one looks. (Including my decision to answer this comment some would say -- heh).

We have schools, best practices, guidelines, standards etc, to try to enforce some good decisions upon people.

That said, if one feels strongly about it, there's always the decision NOT to buy such a laptop.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#214

Post by FroshKiller »

72deluxe wrote: post #174
cageface wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've written a lot of C++ code in Xcode. Xcode is a pretty poor IDE in general but it works reasonably well for C++. IMO things like autocomplete and a graphical debugger are enough of a productivity boost that I wouldn't want to use a plain editor.

Yes, and the ability to find call references (who is calling this function, where is it used) from the drop-down menu is really helpful. I miss the ease of access to that sort of functionality in Visual Studio.

Maybe I'm not using the same version of Visual Studio as you are, but Find All References is right there on the context menu when I right-click in VS.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#215

Post by tonyedgecombe »

ygra wrote: post #159
nicky0 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shit, last time I was on Windows, WPF was the new hotness. What is the latest thing?

UWP, I guess. It's still similar enough from what I've seen, but I haven't used it yet. And WPF is still by far the best UI framework I've ever used.

Windows 10 only rules it out for me, also I think it might be tied to the Windows store although I'm not absolutely sure.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#216

Post by brazzledazzle »

muninn_ wrote: post #202
brazzledazzle wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't care about the touch bar and while I'm miffed about the magsafe I can deal with shelling out extra for accidental damage insurance. Personally my disappointment is with the specs which no time with the machine will change. The mac I'm currently using was purchased 3 years with 16GB of RAM and if I replace it I will be stuck with the same capacity. I imagine there are a lot of "Pro" market segments that are we…

The ram you were using 3 years ago is a lot slower than the ram they have put into the new MacBook pros. So there is that benefit at least. 32 GB is a lot of ram. What do you do where you need that much ram in a laptop? Is that the limiting factor in performance for you versus another component? Have you considered a desktop/tablet combo or anything like that?

To be fair I don't bump up against it daily so this isn't some kind of deal breaker. Just disappointing.

Mostly virtualization (server and/or desktop operating systems) but sometimes decent sized datasets (which really aren't too bad from SSD) and occasionally those things combined with software that is... written poorly. I used to use both a desktop and laptop but it was more trouble than it was worth. I might have to revisit but I'll miss having those workloads local.

I have no doubt I'm an outlier and I certainly don't expect Apple to change anything. I'm not really resentful, just disappointed.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#217

Post by edpichler »

SiVal wrote: post #17

So Microsoft is treating the Mac more seriously as a professional platform while Apple is treating it less seriously? I'm not saying this in a snarky way; I mean it literally as a change of corporate strategies in both companies. Microsoft seems to be saying, If you are a pro mainly using the Mac for professional work, we want to do a better job of empowering you, and Apple seems to be saying, If you are a pro mainly…

I think Microsoft is saying that they want the market, they want their products running on all platforms, and not that "Mac OS is a serious platform".

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#218

Post by moljacsharp »

Jaruzel wrote: post #44
jpalomaki wrote: post #15

Interesting, but I can also see some risks with their approach. Now they have three different Visual Studios with completely different technology stacks. 1) Visual Studio for Windows (C++, I assume?) 2) Visual Studio Code (Javascript, Atom) 3) Visual Studio for Mac (C#)

Visual Studio for Windows is mainly written in C# I believe.

Nope.

Most of the UI was rewritten for VS2010 with WPF (XAML, DirectX acceleration), but lower/deeper parts are written in c++ and this makes porting "probelmatic" (MFC, win32.dll, kernel.dll to posix stuff).

MonoDevelop ~ Xamarin.Studio is written in C# (some plugins in F#) and this makes porting easier. That is the reason there was MonoDevelop version on Windows.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#219

Post by Cthulhu_ »

philliphaydon wrote: post #191
delegate wrote: post #188

This is nice of course, but without C++ support it has very little appeal to me. I don't want to learn C# to write iOS apps. I might learn it just for fun, but I will continue writing the iOS apps with Swift/Objective-C and C++. C++ support is the weak spot of Xcode and so far I haven't found a suitable IDE for C++, except maybe Qt Creator and several IntelliJ-based IDEs, which are ok but not on par with Visual Studi…

Why don't you want to learn c# for iOS / Android development?

It's not iOS / Android development, it's Xamarin development. Not really the same thing.

Re: Visual Studio for Mac

#220

Post by coldtea »

sundvor wrote: post #177
Angostura wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would presume that if the application hasn't been updated for the Touchbar, the Touchbar would default to displaying ESC F1 F2 F3 F4 etc..

As a touch typist, can you please explain how that would work for me?

As a touch typist, can you please explain how function keys are particularly relevant to touch typing?

Stepping through the debugger is not typing, and function keys change role according to the selected app anyway. And when they are system function keys (brightness, volume, etc) they are even more irrelevant to typing and/or touch typing.

Besides, there's nothing particularly hard about finding a touch based F6 key compared to a physical F6 key. A key's position (which won't change) gives more of a clue than the key's boundaries.

Heck, it's called touch typing -- a touch strip doesn't sound that alien to it.

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