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Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

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Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#211
post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what happens when a Cessna parachutes onto the roof of your house? Onto the middle of a busy street? etc. If we were all using flying cars, this would become a regular occurrence. It's just not practical at that scale.

What happens when a car veers off the road into your living room?

Most roads don't point at people's living rooms. Now and then I see a house at the top of a T intersection, and I can't imagine living there. I used to drive down a country road that had nice houses a few feet from a curve in the road, so any car that didn't make the turn would hit the house. I would never live there, either.

But imagine hundreds or thousands of small aircraft flying over your house every day, driven by non-pilots, maintained like automobiles. I wouldn't want to live there, either.

Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably much less damage, because a typical car in the city is going much slower than a typical plane falling from the sky, and kinetic energy goes with square of velocity...

A plane (with BRS parachute) falls at 10-20mph, according to BRS's website. Typically a small plane will weigh about 2000-3000lb. A car in the city will be going at about 30mph, and will weigh about 4000lb. There are news stories here regularly of cars driving into storefronts. Generally when I hear a story about a Cirrus activating their parachute, it lands on empty space and doesn't do any damage.

Drop a 3,000 lb aircraft on a roof at 20 mph, and I think it will break through the roof.

Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A plane (with BRS parachute) falls at 10-20mph, according to BRS's website. Typically a small plane will weigh about 2000-3000lb. A car in the city will be going at about 30mph, and will weigh about 4000lb. There are news stories here regularly of cars driving into storefronts. Generally when I hear a story about a Cirrus activating their parachute, it lands on empty space and doesn't do any damage.

Any reason you couldn't add steering controls to an emergency parachute, just like skydivers use? Not manually pulled, but with some small emergency actuators? Basically you'd just need the ability to pull down corners of the parachute, right?

Maybe. But if you're making an emergency landing in a populated area, there is generally no safe place to land. Parachute or not, you're probably going to land on or in the middle of something, and injury or property damage is almost certain.

Whereas, if my car breaks down on the street...

Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I contend that people are happier and healthier where the population density is lower, resulting in less crime, less pollution, less noise, lower cost of living, more space, more privacy, etc. If you want to live in big buildings, packed together like sardines, unable to escape from the noise of your neighbors and everything that goes on in the city outside the window, more power to you. But don't presume to say that…

The problem is that usually you still have to commute to work. Living far away from jobs means a long, unhappy commute. The unhappiness caused by long commutes is well researched - look it up if you like. People compromise and live somewhere in between, which often means the worst of both worlds. Contrary to what you say, dense cities can be quiet and have isolated private space. Look at the vast single-family-home s…

> The problem is that usually you still have to commute to work. Living far away from jobs means a long, unhappy commute. The unhappiness caused by long commutes is well researched - look it up if you like. People compromise and live somewhere in between, which often means the worst of both worlds.

Plenty of people do not have to make long commutes, or they choose to do so for certain reasons. This is such a generalization that it's not very useful.

More interesting would be solving the problem of people needing to commute in the first place. How many of those jobs that people commute to actually must be done in the place they commute to? And I don't mean telecommuting, I mean, does that business really need to be located in that city? In the case of many office jobs, they could be located in smaller cities to begin with, so people wouldn't have to live as far away. Of course, this is also a nearly useless generalization.

However, I would suggest that the real problem here is, sadly, politics. How many business decisions are dictated by local laws, regulations, taxes, etc? How many businesses would relocate if it weren't for certain of these that make only a few locations feasible? And how many of those political decisions are caused by other businesses lobbying for them, whether to enhance their own advantages or disadvantage their competitors?

> Contrary to what you say, dense cities can be quiet and have isolated private space. Look at the vast single-family-home suburbs of Tokyo. The population density is high even without large buildings, and you can live without a car easily (if desired), but you have your own house with a garden on a quiet, secluded street in a safe neighborhood all within walking distance of the train that can take you downtown. Not particularly cheap or spacious, though. The noisy, crime-riddled, no-privacy-at-all hellish city you describe is common, but it's not the only possibility.

This is the exception, not the rule. And I don't think Tokyo is a great example. My neighbors have a garden--it occupies as much space as their house. What kind of a garden would they have if they lived in a single-family home in a Tokyo suburb? A window box? And they would probably pay 5 times as much in living expenses, at least.

I would suggest that most cities in the world are noisy, crime-riddled, no-privacy hellholes--at least, unless you are very wealthy. The average person in the average city can't afford to live in a quiet, safe, private dwelling. But the same person making the same money living in a suburb or small town can afford a much nicer, safer, quieter home, and nearly everything they need to buy is cheaper there as well.

> What the sibling comment says is true about social interaction in cities as well. Living in the city people have more friends, more sexual partners, attend more events, and interact more with strangers. For some that is a plus.

For some, it is. Of course, it depends on how you define "city." But many people live happily and healthily in smaller places all around the world, with families and friends and local events (ones they probably have a larger role in, as well). It's not necessary to live in a big city to have a social life or a vibrant community. People have been celebrating harvest festivals for thousands of years.

Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A plane (with BRS parachute) falls at 10-20mph, according to BRS's website. Typically a small plane will weigh about 2000-3000lb. A car in the city will be going at about 30mph, and will weigh about 4000lb. There are news stories here regularly of cars driving into storefronts. Generally when I hear a story about a Cirrus activating their parachute, it lands on empty space and doesn't do any damage.

Drop a 3,000 lb aircraft on a roof at 20 mph, and I think it will break through the roof.

Maybe not:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters_(2014_season)#Pian...

a 1400lb piano dropped from 50ft (40mph at impact) won't break through a roof.

Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot the big one: Most small aircraft cannot fly in bad weather. If it's raining, windy, or even cloudy these things are going to be grounded if the pilot doesn't have an instrument rating.

Not to mention icing conditions!

Not to mention how little skill that a big percentage of people have just driving cars. Can't even get people to follow the speed limit - fat chance you'd get them to follow aviation regulations.

Most people in cars that make mistakes end up in a crash but don't die. Everyone in a portable flying device that makes a mistake will die.

Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#217
post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot the big one: Most small aircraft cannot fly in bad weather. If it's raining, windy, or even cloudy these things are going to be grounded if the pilot doesn't have an instrument rating.

They can be automatically disabled for when there's bad weather.

Hahaha. The function of my flying car is controlled by - Meteorology? Now that's funny. I have respect for meteorologist (heck - for me it was either that or computer science) but even today local forecasting is not reliable enough to base the functionality of devices upon.

Re: Larry Page’s startups working on flying cars

#218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drop a 3,000 lb aircraft on a roof at 20 mph, and I think it will break through the roof.

Maybe not: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters_(2014_season)#Pian... a 1400lb piano dropped from 50ft (40mph at impact) won't break through a roof.

Uh, yes it did. Did you read what you cited?

> A baby grand piano weighing 1,400 pounds (640 kg) pierced its legs through the roof but was unable to fully break through.

I consider the legs breaking through to be "breaking through the roof."

Then:

> Calling the myth busted, the team loaded another upright piano with enough sand to reach a total weight of 2,600 pounds (1,200 kg), much more than a full-size grand piano, then dropped it from 75 feet (23 m) above the roof. This time, the piano did smash a hole in the roof and landed on the floor.

Since we've been talking about a heavier aircraft, anyway, I hardly think this Mythbusters experiment proves anything here. As much as I enjoy watching the show, it's not a scientific study of how roofs are affected by heavy objects falling on them. There are a variety of factors to consider, including design, materials, condition, etc.

And finally, even if it didn't pierce the roof in any way, when it slid off the roof, it would land on something, damaging or injuring it.

The bottom line is that you don't want aircraft falling on your house.

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