I love how the guy quoted saying that they can't teach white, male middle managers empathy is a white male middle manager. I guess he's saying that he's proud of what he is.
GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
211–220 of 1001 posts
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
At what point does it become a systemic problem, though? Github is a major software company, and there are similar signs at other major companies, most of whom are starting down a similar path.
> At what point does it become a systemic problem, though? When it's actually hard to get a job as a white male developer. We're very far from that point.
That's not really what I'm asking, though. Yes, let's say it's not actually hard yet. Is it reasonable to ignore signs that things might get to that point and wait for if and when it does?
I think it's reasonable to worry well before that.
(I don't know what if anything we can or should do aside from worry.)
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#213She certainly doesn't say "only white" and she explicitly excludes white women ("some of the biggest barriers to progress"). You can make convoluted excuses for her, but it's obvious that she sees white people (of whatever gender or socioeconomic status) as essentially enemies, and doesn't want them as allies (let alone is willing to accept some of them as people with different, but valid opinions). It's not acceptab…
There is a subtle irony in your comment. I think it is interesting to tease out because much of the arguments on diversity come from one's own perspective.
So, if you'll indulge me, your argument is essentially 'us vs them' is a bad thing. About right? If so, I agree. We're not going to solve an exclusionary tech culture by excluding people or creating two sides to a debating war.
But what strikes me is that your comment didn't even reference Nicole Sanchez by name once. Your comment was "she" and "her" time and time again. Did you even notice yourself do it? I somehow doubt it was intentional. But I'm an optimist.
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#214Out with flat org structure based purely on meritocracy, in with supervisors and middle managers. This has ticked off many people in the old guard.
This is almost certainly a mistake, from my experience. Our fairly small team's productivity dropped by I'd estimate 300% even with a much larger team once HQ decided we needed to bring in management layers. I wonder what GH hopes to gain from these changes.
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do you have an arrest record? If not: there's the magic power. Statistically speaking, a poor young black male is much more likely to have an arrest record than a poor young white male. Edit: holy batman the downvotes. I never considered the possibility that maybe #hnwatch is right.
> Do you have an arrest record? If not: there's the magic power. Statistically speaking, a poor young black male is much more likely to have an arrest record than a poor young white male. > Edit: holy batman the downvotes. I never considered the possibility that maybe #hnwatch is right. Its unfortunate that you are being downvoted without comment. The downvotes may or may not be evidence that #hnwatch is correct, it…
I am pretty sure that if the prior for #hnwatch being right has non-zero probability, then the downvotes are evidence that strengthens the posterior.
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#216Earlier quoted context omitted.
Feminism wasn't always as intersectional as it is now. For a long time it was dominated by white women who wanted more equality ignoring and sometimes even opposing equality for people and women of color. Suffragettes are a very good example of this problem. There are a few people now that feel a similar thing is happening in the tech industry right now as well. In that diversity is promoted only in so far as it help…
Yeah, whereas now it's dominated by white women who get book deals off the back of their supposed anti-racist credentials, whereas the black activists who they got their arguments from (and watered them down, naturally) languish unmentioned in obscurity. There's a a lot of complicated history and anger behind the distrust of white feminist activists, most of which I don't think ever reached the mainstream media in an…
I can't deny that I feel some amount of Schadenfreude. And also a strange longing for popcorn.
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
> So the technical director and member of the social-impact team is a blatant racist. I had the same reaction. I'm surprised nobody else has noticed this and made a comment about it.
It rather seems that the entire thread is now about this totally minor and uninteresting point, all the while ignoring the GitHub-the-company-is-broken argument. The inability to understand priorities is not surprising but talent isn't leaving GH because of reverse racism: it's the horrible leadership and the dismantling of one of the most innovative workplace cultures that suck.
Wasn't it pretty obvious github was broken when the hovarth episode happened?
They are in a special cognitive dissonance zone, they are wildly successful and that cures a lot of problems. They have time and money to worry about issues that aren't the products, and be vocal about it. Now the community seems to be mostly pacified, they like git and github has the mindshare, but they are coasting. Or so it seems, maybe the enterprise version I've never used has some badass features.
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#218The content in this article is disgusting and despicable. I will be moving my code from GitHub as soon as possible.
GitLab is pretty nice and auto-imports from GitHub!
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
GitHub has, since the Horvath incident, made it pretty clear what kind of person they want to hire. And, frankly, that's fine. There are plenty of places where I, as a competent white male, can get hired and promoted without difficulty. The fact that Github isn't one of those is not a systematic problem. More power to them.
At what point does it become a systemic problem, though? Github is a major software company, and there are similar signs at other major companies, most of whom are starting down a similar path.
> Github is a major software company...
I don't know what your definition of major is, but Github is not it in my book. Don't get me wrong, they make a semi-decent product, better than anyone else at this point, but they are by no means the only solution in their market.
Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart
#220Bring on the suits! While GH is busy distracting their world-class engineers with B.S. reverse-racism meetings, they will successfully free up their equity pool for more suit hires. That should suck the life out real quick...
Goodbye revolutionary, forward-thinking work culture & hierarchy (meritocracy). You will be gravely missed. Good luck hiring sub-par engineers for the next 2 years and watching your data centers go down on a daily basis.
I guess the only question left is... who are you switching to?