It’s impossible to work your way through college nowadays • Hacker News Board

Re: It’s impossible to work your way through college nowadays

#201

Post by morgante » Tue, Mar 25, 2014, 7:38 AM UTC

FG_Regulus wrote: post #190

morgante wrote: post #155

It's certainly a troubling trend, but it's not as troubling as it seems. One huge factor is the corresponding increase in financial aid, particularly at top institutions——if you came from a poor family several decades ago, you would have had to work your way through Harvard, now you will get full aid and can even get grants for summer activities. That's honestly a huge boon to meritocracy which we should not forget a…

White kid from the lower middle-class. 4.7 high school with all honors and graduating with an AA. Had to start almsot completely over classes-wise because of the structure of the CS degree so what should have been 3 years is now 4 years at $16k a year. And $24k for the last year because of the new "if you go over X hours in your degree you pay double tuition" rule. So $72k of debt stepping out of that door. Almost al…

I'm also a white kid from the lower middle class. :)

Maybe you're not pursuing the right jobs? With a CS degree, even internships should be paying WAY more than minimum wage.

Re: It’s impossible to work your way through college nowadays

#202

Post by Nrsolis » Wed, Mar 26, 2014, 2:17 PM UTC

ludston wrote: post #188

Nrsolis wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could make the argument that disabled veterans are the MOST important voting block and with good reason. Please refrain from reducing veterans to a political action committee. They deserve much more than they currently get under our system. Try and get through the red tape at the VA and then tell me how you feel about the outsize effect that the veterans are having on the benefits debate.

Is it so unreasonable to believe that non-conscripted veterans deserve exactly the same financial status as their equivalent non-veteran counterparts? (Disabled or otherwise). This argument comes from anti-nationalist, pro-equality-of-opportunity values.

Yes. I believe it's WHOLLY unreasonable.

Veterans who go to war come back bearing terrible scars. They are routinely subjected to horrific conditions that would make you cringe. They are asked to do terrible things to terrible people and still maintain a standard of professional conduct that civilians cannot maintain.

SO I do believe it's unreasonable to treat war veterans, who volunteered to sacrifice themselves and their lives to defend our way of life, just like any other citizen who needs some governmental support.

Veterans who have no obligation to serve but do so anyway deserve our utmost respect and admiration. And on the list of people who contribute to the safety, security, and greatness of this country, they are at the very top.

Re: It’s impossible to work your way through college nowadays

#203

Post by Suncho » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 4:11 AM UTC

FLUX-YOU wrote: post #171

Suncho wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a lot of the rise in tuition has to do with jobs. Society tells people they need to earn a living through a job. This makes people desperate for jobs to the extent that they'll generally pay whatever it takes to maximize their job prospects. So, basically you have a situation in which demand for the best possible education is inelastic. Pretty much everybody wants it and is willing to pay anything they can fo…

MOOCs will only work if they garner a reputation of providing education relevant to employers or even lead to jobs. Also important are college connections to businesses to facilitate internships. Internships can really make or break you in same cases. I know most MOOC courses are up to par. I've taken several and the introductory Python programming course at Udacity was more difficult than any of the classes from my…

When you say "MOOCs will only work if..." it really depends what you mean by "work." Does it make sense for the goal of education to be jobs?

Like you say, high quality MOOCs can really help people learn. The reason I mentioned MOOCs alongside basic income is because basic income removes people's dependence on jobs.

Re: It’s impossible to work your way through college nowadays

#204

Post by maxvu » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 6:30 AM UTC

Falling3 wrote: post #129

maxvu wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a commonly-expressed complaint at my private, engineering-focused school that, of all the egregious capital investment is in things that have high donor selling potential but little use to the student body: a beautiful new athletic facility (we're D1 in only one sport) and a "performing arts center" where artists are subsidized residency and no student programs (not even through our tiny arts department) are acc…

Hmm... that sounds exactly like my alma mater... Any chance this is upstate NY as well?

This is exactly your alma mater.

Re: It’s impossible to work your way through college nowadays

#205

Post by e12e » Thu, Mar 27, 2014, 5:01 PM UTC

glenra wrote: post #77

jiggy2011 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CS people are probably in a somewhat unique position where that is somewhat possible. If you study something that isn't tied to a specific industry or where you need many years of training and certification to become useful that's not so tenable.

I can't speak to other times and places but in silicon valley in the late 1980s I went to a temp agency and looked for unskilled work during the summer - I don't think I ever came across any jobs that paid as low as minimum wage. One summer I was a "shipping clerk" (meaning: guy who gets stuff out of a warehouse and puts it in boxes) at Syva - that paid over twice the minimum. Another summer I did data entry for the…

> One summer [...paid] over twice the minimum.

Ok, so from the chart, on minimum wage you'd work 10 hours per credit, at twice the minimum wage you'd work 5 hours. For 2013 you'd work 60 hours at minimum wage or 30 hours at twice the minimum wage.

I'd say there's quite a difference between 5 and 30 hours either way?