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What is Microsoft smoking?

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Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#201

Post by kryten »

Zarathust wrote: post #185
jemeshsu wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They tried to emulate apple while forgetting that people that bought into apple ideology already had apple. Agreed. Their enterprise offering is strong. And one day they will realize it is IBM that is their destiny, and drop out of consumer market.

I see Microsoft in a position similar to RIM 5 - 8 years back. They have tons of revenue from big business that are kinda locked in to their stack. There is no need for large innovation in those very mature markets and they innovate by pushing more of the same. I may not be an office power use, but I see very little significant changes in Office since 2003, only small features tweaked.

It's even worse than that. If you are a power user and turn off the toolbars etc, excel 97 isn't that much different to excel 2013.

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#203

Post by kryten »

sentenza wrote: post #142
venomsnake wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft had all the cards to win the device war. But they forgot what made them win the PC war. They tried to emulate apple while forgetting that people that bought into apple ideology already had apple. If the W8 arm was unlocked it would have been a big winner. WP7 just needed fast moving instead of stagnation and they almost got everything right with the original xbox and X360 in the beginning. But I am moving a…

From my experience, Arch with KDE and XP/Win7 are extremely similar with regards to user experience quality, so that I myself wouldn't be willing to call one or the other better. At this point, a person more used to Windows might get annoyed by having to edit config files on Arch/KDE every so often, and a person more into Linux might be frustrated that in Windows, some things can't be easily fixed. But these are more…

Quality really hits you when you have to set up postfix, dovecot-lda, dovecot imap, ldap auth and an NFS share to store mail on.

I'd genuinely rather use exchange and active directory!

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#204

Post by hackinthebochs »

kryten wrote: post #200
hackinthebochs wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In one of their presentations they mentioned "instant start", i.e. it downloads just enough to get you started then downloads the rest in the background.

Its probably the same streaming tech office 2010 home and student uses. It basically makes it unusable. Every time you click something it lags for 30-40 seconds while it caches dlls. Horrible tech.

I doubt its the same tech as the code to do this in a game would be totally different than the code for a desktop application. There's a big difference between JIT downloading and prioritizing so that you can start the game. I swear some people will find any reason to get in a shot against MS.

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#205

Post by kryten »

inthewind wrote: post #183
kryten wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving windows 8 around is trivial. Most of the time it just activates. Occasionally it makes you phone them which takes about 3-4 mins. However when you have a VLK and you don't notice that the KMS server has fallen over, shit hits the fan on an epic scale...

Idiots guide to moving it from one machine to another?

Just install it from scratch on the new machine with the same key, copy your files over and delete the source installation. Don't ever move it or move disks - it will shit a brick.

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#206

Post by kryten »

hackinthebochs wrote: post #204
kryten wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its probably the same streaming tech office 2010 home and student uses. It basically makes it unusable. Every time you click something it lags for 30-40 seconds while it caches dlls. Horrible tech.

I doubt its the same tech as the code to do this in a game would be totally different than the code for a desktop application. There's a big difference between JIT downloading and prioritizing so that you can start the game. I swear some people will find any reason to get in a shot against MS.

I've used windows for over 20 years. I think I've earned my right to bitch about the bad bits :)

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#207

Post by falcolas »

potatolicious wrote: post #191
falcolas wrote: post #187

I don't think that Sony "won" E3, or that Microsoft lost. Instead, Sony called Microsoft's bluff. Stay with me here. All of the restrictions that Microsoft has put forth are enforced by software - they can all be pretty easily reverted. I'm willing to bet that Microsoft was really hoping that Sony would see this as the future of console gaming, and would follow their lead at E3. This way consumers would have been giv…

> "they can all be pretty easily reverted" Can they though? Sure, it's pretty trivial to remove the code that enforces these restrictions, but I don't think it's Microsoft enforcing it. Think about it - used games (mostly) go through authorized retailers, can only be sold once, where said retailers collect a cut, and Microsoft collects none. This isn't about Microsoft's bottom line, this is about the bottom line of G…

Any pressure against Microsoft from the above retailers/publishers would be equally against Sony and Nintendo, since Microsoft doesn't own the market in any sense of the word.

Since Sony didn't implement it, it's fair to say the pressure isn't that strong.

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#208

Post by untog »

potatolicious wrote: post #191
falcolas wrote: post #187

I don't think that Sony "won" E3, or that Microsoft lost. Instead, Sony called Microsoft's bluff. Stay with me here. All of the restrictions that Microsoft has put forth are enforced by software - they can all be pretty easily reverted. I'm willing to bet that Microsoft was really hoping that Sony would see this as the future of console gaming, and would follow their lead at E3. This way consumers would have been giv…

> "they can all be pretty easily reverted" Can they though? Sure, it's pretty trivial to remove the code that enforces these restrictions, but I don't think it's Microsoft enforcing it. Think about it - used games (mostly) go through authorized retailers, can only be sold once, where said retailers collect a cut, and Microsoft collects none. This isn't about Microsoft's bottom line, this is about the bottom line of G…

This isn't about Microsoft's bottom line, this is about the bottom line of GameStop, EA, Activision, etc.

And it's them that will make or break this choice. If they deprioritise the Playstation platform because it allows customers to sell used games, MS could still win out. If they back down and support the Playstation just fine, MS loses. So it's not even in Microsoft's hands.

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#209

Post by erikpukinskis »

sauravc wrote: post #189
astrodust wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What made them win the PC war was what landed them in federal court. By controlling the Windows ecosystem they could "disrupt" any competitors trying to produce applications, pushing Office while alternatives struggled, and they could use Office to push Windows. Charging OEMs a flat "per-CPU" fee for licensing meant that Microsoft was getting paid regardless of the OS being shipped on the system. They eventually had…

What landed them in Federal Court was bundling a browser (the most advanced at the time) with their OS for free. Over a decade later, we all know that a consumer OS that ships without a browser is an incomplete product (as BillG testified in the case). What Apple is doing now with dictatorial actions in its app stores is just as, if not more, overreaching IMHO. Does that make it OK? No. But keep in mind why people we…

They did more than bundle a browser, they gave OEMs financial incentives NOT to bundle Netscape.

The reason why Apple's dictatorial actions don't bother me is they're only a small part of the market. If I want to develop a mobile web browser, I can still use Android and have a market.

With Windows, Microsoft WAS the market.

Re: What is Microsoft smoking?

#210

Post by georgeecollins »

falcolas wrote: post #187

I don't think that Sony "won" E3, or that Microsoft lost. Instead, Sony called Microsoft's bluff. Stay with me here. All of the restrictions that Microsoft has put forth are enforced by software - they can all be pretty easily reverted. I'm willing to bet that Microsoft was really hoping that Sony would see this as the future of console gaming, and would follow their lead at E3. This way consumers would have been giv…

I think the two strategies are not so much about Sony or MSFTs bottom line, but appeals to different constituencies.

Retailers do not want online DRM because they make most of their money from used game sales. Developers want online DRM because they make their money from first time sale only.

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