Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

blog.katylevinson.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

201–210 of 227 posts

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#201

Post by stephencanon »

lmm wrote: post #181
stephencanon wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Knuth quote regarding premature optimization is rarely so apt.

Being able to spend less time talking to the people I don't want to (and more time talking to the people I do) would probably be the single greatest improvement to my life. It's not at all premature to expend a bit of effort on it.

Two things: first, learning how to talk to people with whom you don't have much in common is remarkably valuable. Second, even if you don't care, making that decision on the basis of how someone is dressed is superficial in the extreme.

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#202

Post by pekk »

summerdown2 wrote: post #154
JulianMorrison wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that men pay attention to supermodel shaped women is (1) sexist (2) very mistaken. Sexist men pay horny attention to them. Horniness is a distraction from a product pitch. "I'm sorry, what did you say again? I was staring at your chest."

The idea that men pay attention to supermodel shaped women is sexist? Surely this is a parody?

Men pay attention to whatever they like, and not all men are attracted to supermodel shaped women, and not all men are equally engaged sexually in situations which have nothing to do with sex or courting.

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#203

Post by pekk »

cdtwigg wrote: post #194
rurounijones wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This might sound bad but... I cannot actually see a problem with #2, it would be my preferred solution. When I go to trade shows / conferences it is to talk to brains, not bodies, the sex of the brain is immaterial to me. To me, making sure the bodies are 50% equal in gender means nothing if 80% of the female bodies are only there to make up a body quota but have no interest / knowledge of what is going on. Maybe cha…

Why assume that anyone who isn't deeply expert in the technical details of a product isn't a full-time employee of the company? Many companies hire sales/marketing people of both genders that may have a relatively superficial understanding of the inner details but are more enthusiastic and outgoing than the engineering staff.

If I go to a technical conference, I am not interested in talking to sales and marketing people of any gender or dimensions. That is something which the sales and marketing people want, not something I want.

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#204

Post by pekk »

hackernewbie wrote: post #173

I feel like there was a time when gender politics wasn't so abrasive in computing. It wasn't healthy, but it didn't make you constantly feel mired in some swamp of unsolvable problems. I preferred the swamp of (un)solvable problems that is computing.

Did the problem not exist before, or was it just invisible?

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#205

Post by illuminate »

roc wrote: post #94
mattmaroon wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that assumption is safe of the women who aren't in costume. I think they're just female employees in non-technical roles. They're not eye candy. That's what I find so strange about the original post. She's assuming they're there as eye candy and they sure don't seem to be. It's odd to hear a woman assume that other women (especially since they're pretty average) are there for their looks. The few I've t…

I've seen the booth-babe role performed exactly as you've described, by dressed-down but attractive women at other conferences and trade shows. And, yes, I'm distinguishing from actual staff who do know the product/service/industry and aren't just contracted short-term to draw people in. Given the article's description, I figured that's what was going on. But, not having been there, I could definitely be getting the…

"I've seen the booth-babe role performed exactly as you've described, by dressed-down but attractive women at other conferences and trade shows."

That's not a "booth babe", if they're being dressed down they've generally been giving training on the actual products. In that case, they're just spokespersons like the attractive marketing dudes with the excellent veneers.

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#206

Post by pekk »

saraid216 wrote: post #126
sharkweek wrote: post #8

I can't imagine how frustrating that must be. But I hate the concept of giving up fighting for yourself. Why not put a few people in their place? If that's just not in your nature, fair enough; but I say make a few guys feel like idiots by stepping up to the plate with your expertise. If they don't like it, that's their problem. And if that fails, I like davidrobert's idea as well -- maybe wear a shirt that has a rea…

Engineers are the group I would expect to understand this the best, since we tend to be proud of our disinterest in selling and marketing ourselves constantly. We want to do competent work, make things happen, keep things working, and move along. Our gold standard for correctness is that no one even knows we exist. And yet on HN, I regularly find engineers who can't seem to grasp any of these things. Maybe it's becau…

I hardly meet any engineers who are proud of their disinterest in selling and marketing themselves. That seems to be the reason to be an engineer anymore. It is sad.

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#207

Post by Tichy »

calibraxis wrote: post #76
redthrowaway wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>1. Do not hire eye candy as eye candy. Of either sex. Dressed up or dressed down. Eye candy is extremely effective in marketing. That's like saying "don't hire smart programmers". Why would companies handicap their marketing efforts?

Sure, that's why you retaliate against such advertisers. Boycotts, public campaigns, etc. Through such efforts, corporations have become noticeably less overt about using people of color and women as inferior objects for the amusement of the dominating classes.

So pretty people would find it harder to find employment in advertising. Wouldn't that be severe discrimination?

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#208

Post by ikailan »

I went to GDC in 2011. I remember that there was a country trying to talk game companies into opening a branch in their country. It was Germany, I believe. They had a beauty pageant contestant dressed in full garb at their booth. It made absolutely no sense at all.

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#209

Post by Tichy »

gavanwoolery wrote: post #152

Sex sells. Actually one of the more popular search terms associated with E3 was "booth babes." Are companies willing to sacrifice their "dignity" in order to have their brand appear in more searches? Absolutely. Some of the most visited sites on the internet are pornography sites. Lets not kid ourselves - we were genetically designed to reproduce and value sexual attraction. The problem is that every one treats women…

I find it ironic if women fight against sexual attraction, effectively depriving themselves of one of their powers. The same pattern can be seen in lots of feminist positions, like deriding of housewives and thereby eroding the privilege of being able to take time off for family.

Re: Booth Babes, Street Clothes, and GDC: Thanks But You sort of Made It Worse

#210

Post by Tichy »

pouletencolere wrote: post #123

This problem isn't limited to conferences. I'm a woman and an engineer, and I can't count the number of times I've met someone at a casual tech meetup and the first thing out of their mouths was "You must be in PR." If you want to make a small difference in making the world a nicer place, just ask me what I do. Booth babes and female sales reps are an interesting thing to discuss, but we can't individually change the…

Why is it such a problem, though? It is statistically unlikely that a woman is developer, so people react accordingly. Does it really hurt so much to say "no, I'm a developer"?
Post reply on HN