Live data from Hacker News

UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

bbc.com

201–210 of 219 posts

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did that with the COVID19 tracker. And ran out of rows https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-54423988

The core data platform for NHS Test and Trace was not Excel based at all. It was a reasonably simple but solid AWS setup using S3, Glue and the smallest Redshift instance at the time, on top of which were Tableau/Quicksight/PowerBI dashboards. Some organisations insisted on enabling an "export to CSV" feature which was...not a good idea for so many reasons, and Public Health England (PHE) in the article found out one…

Have you got a source for the s3/glue/redshift bit?

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#202
post #100

Palantir needs to be banned in every EU country. The UK would be wise to do the same. I would never trust an openly MAGA company.

Weird line to draw, when the merger of the American tech sector and the military-industrial complex is in full swing. Palantir isn't the only company providing surveillance and economic viability to the Israeli occupation of Palestine.

Oh, that's not the line I drew. My line is way, way more stringent.

As long as the utterly unreliable, unstable, incompetent and unwise leadership in the US threatens to annex EU territory, every step should be taken to lessen our reliance on US defence equipment in any shape or form.

You don't seem to realise how close to war we already came. If Iran didn't weaken the US ambitions, Cuba, Panama and Greenland would have been next on the list.

Luckily, some people in the US start to realise how stupid they now look.

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#203

Palantir needs to be banned in every EU country. The UK would be wise to do the same. I would never trust an openly MAGA company.

That "Press Release" they put out with echos of Nazi Germany should have been enough for anyone

Absolutely. Americans don't realise what shitstorm they are in.

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#204
post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NHS does have a problem that it is built as a collection of individual trusts all using their own IT systems and after decades has an issue with transferring data between trusts. So that's why an interconnected system is required in order to share data between the trusts while maintaining compatibility with their existing processes

This just sounds like 'We have too many systems, so lets build another one to solve the problem!" https://xkcd.com/927/

No it doesn't, people are against it due to their ties, not because they don't like the service.

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The core data platform for NHS Test and Trace was not Excel based at all. It was a reasonably simple but solid AWS setup using S3, Glue and the smallest Redshift instance at the time, on top of which were Tableau/Quicksight/PowerBI dashboards. Some organisations insisted on enabling an "export to CSV" feature which was...not a good idea for so many reasons, and Public Health England (PHE) in the article found out one…

Have you got a source for the s3/glue/redshift bit?

Page 68 of this PDF (https://covid19.public-inquiry.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/05...), section G2 titled "Testing and Operations Data" has some high level information. I know the details because I designed and built the first version when I was at Deloitte, so I suppose it depends on how much you believe me...

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#206
post #152
post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So, £100k/year = bad, £120k/year via an external consultancy = good. Ding ding ding. This is all driven by ideological mistrust of the public sector, as you've pointed out and people are even defending in the comments.

> £100k/year = bad, £120k/year via an external consultancy = good actually kind of makes sense. The £600 a day is as long as you need it and can be stopped when you don't. A £100k government employee basically has a guaranteed job for life and gold plated pension.

£100k per year means their boss gets the blame if things go wrong. £120k means you get to blame the contractor. It's an accountability sink.

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#207
post #44

The contract with NHS is about 300 mil, public don't want it, most GPs don't want it, so let's drop that next.

Developing a replacement system is still going to cost a hell of a lot. It's not like if you dropped palatir then we'd suddenly have a free drop-in replacement and everyone can have their fiver back

Yes, a replacement will cost money. But probably less than a year contract with Palantir.

Mistakes were made (I would argue intentionally because of local wallet minima with stakeholders), there is a sunk cost to using Palantir. The country can't even develop it further, because it's Palantir's. That's not an argument to keep using it.

The country needs to develop the ability, to develop critical national infrastructure (this includes software, obviously is not limited to it). I would also argue it already has the ability, we need to prevent it from withering away.

Palantir will do the same as local companies (building on top of open source) except it needs to make a large tech profit and with its monopolistic ability, It will capture the value for itself.

Procurement has a misaligned efficiency incentive. Procurement and governments want a single provider so it's less direct cost on them on managing projects. Sadly, they've actually unnaturally forced a monopoly, resulting in serious costs and inefficiencies in the long term. We need a way to encourage multiple providers for the same thing, and allow new companies to join in even when they're late. Just like B2B and B2C.

I wonder if anyone has some thoughts in this area

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#208
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The issue with this is that this is happening with full support of government employees, and even the courts cooperate to a lesser extent. Why is that an issue? The simplest explanation is that the underlying rate of mental illness is inconveniently high. Which would tally with, as you say: > In fact, nothing is expected at all (other than medical evidence). Also I would take a look at the date when the upcurve sta…

> Why is that an issue? What’s the counterweight to keep the system in check and from growing out of control? If the only message is yes, it sets up a positive feedback loop. Looking back and guessing whether Covid justifies it is post hoc rationalization. It says nothing about the validity of individual claims. Fraud schemes in the same timeframe could benefit just as well.

> What’s the counterweight to keep the system in check and from growing out of control? If the only message is yes, it sets up a positive feedback loop.

Nice try, but that's begging the question. Why is it a problem for the government employees to do their jobs and for the courts to enforce the law?

> Looking back and guessing whether Covid justifies it is post hoc rationalization.

So is making an accusation of rampant fraud that just happened to coincide with a badly-contained pandemic. Occam's Razor makes increased sickness the null hypothesis. It's on you to do more than raise vague insinuations if you want to show the main weight of the problem here is anything other than that, with the usual derisory level of fraud at the edges as a rounding error.

> It says nothing about the validity of individual claims.

Let me introduce you to a concept you may find useful: go and read up on this thing called "statistics", you might find it helps.

> Fraud schemes in the same timeframe could benefit just as well

And? Show they're the problem. Show them increasing. Show why they started increasing exactly then.

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#209
post #189
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why is that an issue? What’s the counterweight to keep the system in check and from growing out of control? If the only message is yes, it sets up a positive feedback loop. Looking back and guessing whether Covid justifies it is post hoc rationalization. It says nothing about the validity of individual claims. Fraud schemes in the same timeframe could benefit just as well.

Plus it just isn't fair. You're making other people work for you without anything in return.

The alternative is a society that says "work or starve". I don't live in that society and I don't want to.

Re: UK government replaces Palantir software with internally-built refugee system

#210
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the more confusing things is the branding. That job posting isn't for NHS England. Or NHS Digital, which doesn't exist any more.

Yeh, the structure is very very very confusing. Largely because you have the Hospital's themselves, then the trusts, then NHS England, or I guess now just the DHSC? And then occasionally even more layers in-between like health boards.

NHSE isn't merged into DHSC yet. Nobody knows what that's going to look like, or when we're going to know. There's every chance the new health secretary will have different ideas.
Post reply on HN