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Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

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Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#201

Post by superfrank »

g4cg54g54 wrote: post #60

same vain as https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47952722 ? HERMES.md in commit messages causes requests to route to extra usage billing 1203 points | 21 hours ago | 524 comments @bcherny well need a bit more than a "Fixed" here... https://github.com/anthropics/claude-code/issues/53262#issue...

I mentioned it in that thread, but when the HERMES bug was first reported multiple people on Reddit claimed that it could also be triggered with openclaw specific file names. It makes me think that instead of going just saying, "this approach for defending against 3rd party oauth isn't working" and rolling things back, they just tried to fix forward and continue with the strategy

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#203

Post by macNchz »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #178
bad_haircut72 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah they probably just typed in "Hey Claude, figure out a way to get our inference spend under control - no mistakes!" and shipped it

Also they ain't wrong. In what other context does OpenClaw get mentioned? "You may not use our service if you mention OpenClaw" is a harsh line but hardly illegal or forbidden any more than any other service restriction (i.e. no use allowed for high-stakes financial modeling). Don't like it, cancel your plan.

There are plenty of ways you could wind up with a git commit containing "OpenClaw" despite zero interaction with OpenClaw itself...adding a blog post to a static site repo, or even a clause in your own app's ToS disallowing use of OpenClaw with your API.

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#204

Post by revolvingthrow »

throwaway277432 wrote: post #113
rich_sasha wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's rather shitty. It's one thing to disallow bypassing preferential pricing models, it's a completely different thing to castrate your model against some uses. You can see how it goes in the future. Wanna vibe code a throwaway script? $0.20. Ah, it's for a legal document search? $10k then. Oh and we'll charge 20% of your app sales too - I can see how they are going in real time, mind you!

Unironically yes. I predict that costs will grow to 80% of what it would cost a human, across the board for everything AI can do. "It's still cheaper than a human" they'll say. Loudly here on HN too. Of course this will happen slowly, very slowly. Lets meet again in 10-20 years.

If openai / anthropic / google were the only game in town then yea, we’d already be paying 5x as much as we do. But local models are so close to sota that it just isn’t going to happen. If I’m a lawyer getting billed $500k/yr on $600k profit I’d rather buy a chonky server and run a model that’s 90% as good and get my money back in 2 years, then pay $5k electricity on $600k profit.

Nobody will successfully lobby for banning local models either, it just isn’t going to happen when the rest of the world will happily avoid paying 80% of their profits to some US bigco for the privilege of existing.

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#205

Post by AstroBen »

NitpickLawyer wrote: post #34
speedgoose wrote: post #2

At least we can assume that Anthropic eats their own dog food. They use Claude to develop their software.

You say that like it's a gotcha. I think the fact that they reached 2B/mo in revenue by dogfooding cc is all the proof that one needs that this thing actually works. In fact it works so well that more people want it than they can serve. For months now they've been having issues when EU and US tz are both online at the same time.

Not really. A person will eventually drink dirty water if it was the only thing available in a desert.

There's very little competition for SOTA models. The models themselves also weren't built by Claude. The current revenue has almost nothing to do with what Claude built.

Hell if it was so far ahead then they wouldn't be desperately trying to block OpenCode.

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#206

Post by rohansood15 »

otterley wrote: post #121
subscribed wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's malicious and I think this is scamming from the literal money (you didn't do anything wrong, you executed one command and they scammed you out of the fair usage you paid for). Please raise the ticket or at least GitHub issue for visibility. Sooner or later some sort of complaint to the relevant trade authority should happen - this is a scam operation at this point.

There are many possible explanations for this outcome to have occurred other than malice. If you're an engineer by trade, consider how many bugs you've been responsible for over the course of your career that you didn't intend. Probably a lot. How about we turn down the heat, everyone?

I am engineer by trade. If I pushed an update which wrongly busted my customer's usage limits at a trillion dollar company, I would expect to get fired. Alongside my EM.

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#207

Post by gjsman-1000 »

cyanydeez wrote: post #198
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is literally nothing close to illegal about this behavior. You read the terms of service right, which provides a long list of explicit and implicit disclaimers?

So, in America, just because it's written in a contract does not mean it's enforceable in anyway. I can make you sign a infinitely generating contract, that doesn't mean it's enforceable/

> So, in America, just because it's written in a contract does not mean it's enforceable in anyway.

But the presumption, as any court will show, is that it is fully blooming enforceable. The burden of proof is on showing it isn't. This particular instance, a lawyer would laugh at you in the face over, this is absolutely 100% stone cold enforceable common and expected.

How do you expect Facebook or HN to moderate if certain uses aren't prohibited? The same principle applies. HN bans certain phrases, lots of them.

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#208

Post by andai »

LoganDark wrote: post #173
vile_wretch wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It also sounds extremely counterproductive to try and sabotage your competition by.. driving your customers away? I have no love for these companies but it's a silly conclusion to jump to.

They don't want customers that make them bleed more money than they're supposed to.

People on OpenClaw discord were bragging about having this stuff running 24/7 and using billions of tokens. I think one guy was using billions per day. (I might have misplaced some zeros but I remember one guy's bill would have been $1000 with API pricing. Per day.)

At the time, enforcement was pretty random, and I think based on how heavy your traffic was.

They weren't all on Claude (though it was the preferred setup) and some people had dozens of accounts hooked up with proxies to avoid hitting limits.

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#209

Post by rglullis »

noctuid wrote: post #171
rglullis wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cancelled my subscription the minute they blocked access via OpenCode and switched to Ollama Cloud. A bunch of people here tried to defend Anthropic, saying that it was justified because it was likely that Claude Code's harness had optimizations that would not be possible on OpenCode. It was clear from the source leak that nothing of this sort was the case, and that they were simply trying to avoid others distillin…

What's just as crazy is people defending ollama.

They are no saints, but at least their solution is actually open source and they can not lock me in like the others can. To illustrate the point, you can replace "Ollama Cloud" with "OpenCode Go" if you want. Or if you prefer you can give enough hardware to run the larger open weight models on my own.

Re: Claude Code refuses requests or charges extra if your commits mention "OpenClaw"

#210

Post by brianwmunz »

__blockcipher__ wrote: post #88

Anthropic is losing a ton of goodwill by not being more honest about their constraints. They've been buckling under load for months, and instead of doing the most honest thing (keep weekly usage limits same, make 5 hour usage limits have surge pricing where the usage-cost of X tokens is scaled based on dynamic load), they're doing a lot of hacky things to try to get a similar effect. I suspect they feel the optics of…

yeah exactly the opacity is doing more damage than the limits themselves. anyone who's worked with AI knows there's a lot of limits you need to contend with. secret behavior changes are another level of badness.
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