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Cloudflare Email Service

blog.cloudflare.com

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Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#201

Post by weird-eye-issue »

woodylondon wrote: post #101

I would pay for Cloudflare Workers Paid ($5) in a heartbeat and currently use the free version of cloudflare for all my DNS / Hosting etc. Where it does not meet my needs i have Dokpoly + Digital Ocean. I would use CloudFlare Containers. I currently pay for resend.com for all my email API needs. The problem is that once you're on the paid plan, you're exposed to unlimited risk if your worker goes crazy due to a stupi…

Have you done the math on this because it's actually very, very difficult to blow up your Cloudflare bill compared to something like Vercel or Firebase.

For example 1 million requests to a Worker is only $0.30 and there's no bandwidth charge. Similar for R2, Pages, etc.

Also I believe their rate limiting rules have been completely free for one or two years now.

Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#202

Post by m463 »

Meekro wrote: post #41

I'm not sure why this announcement has generated so much irritation in the comments-- Cloudflare has been transitioning from "DDoS protection" to "AWS competitor" for many years now, and this is just their alternative to AWS SES. It's an email sender that you can access through an API, or directly through Workers. For those who haven't been keeping up over the years, Workers is their product for running code on Cloud…

they are a gatekeeper, and along with DDOS protection, they are also setting defacto internet policies, like what browser you should use to access websites.

Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#203

Post by el_sinchi »

foolswisdom wrote: post #120
b2m9 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Excuse me, what are you referring to?

There have been stories about people with heavy internet traffic (generally media streaming I think) being more or less shut down unless they upgrade their cloudflare plan (to enterprise I guess). Some were posted on HN in the past.

[dead]

Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#205

Post by austhrow743 »

gpi wrote: post #98
password4321 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cloudflare is spending years of goodwill earned through technical skill, trending towards AI enshittification starting with their blog posts and vibe coded features/products.

Unfortunate situation. Also, what is cloudflare exactly? They seemed to have diversified a tad much.

Just a cloud dev infrastructure provider like Amazon Web Services or Google Cloud Platform.

Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#206

Post by gls2ro »

woodylondon wrote: post #101

I would pay for Cloudflare Workers Paid ($5) in a heartbeat and currently use the free version of cloudflare for all my DNS / Hosting etc. Where it does not meet my needs i have Dokpoly + Digital Ocean. I would use CloudFlare Containers. I currently pay for resend.com for all my email API needs. The problem is that once you're on the paid plan, you're exposed to unlimited risk if your worker goes crazy due to a stupi…

I think it is possible.

I was reading the pricing page for workers and here is what it says there:

> To prevent accidental runaway bills or denial-of-wallet attacks, configure the maximum amount of CPU time that can be used per invocation by defining limits in your Worker's Wrangler file, or via the Cloudflare dashboard (Workers & Pages > Select your Worker > Settings > CPU Limits).

Link: end of example 4 section: https://developers.cloudflare.com/workers/platform/pricing/

Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#207

Post by weird-eye-issue »

gls2ro wrote: post #206
woodylondon wrote: post #101

I would pay for Cloudflare Workers Paid ($5) in a heartbeat and currently use the free version of cloudflare for all my DNS / Hosting etc. Where it does not meet my needs i have Dokpoly + Digital Ocean. I would use CloudFlare Containers. I currently pay for resend.com for all my email API needs. The problem is that once you're on the paid plan, you're exposed to unlimited risk if your worker goes crazy due to a stupi…

I think it is possible. I was reading the pricing page for workers and here is what it says there: > To prevent accidental runaway bills or denial-of-wallet attacks, configure the maximum amount of CPU time that can be used per invocation by defining limits in your Worker's Wrangler file, or via the Cloudflare dashboard (Workers & Pages > Select your Worker > Settings > CPU Limits). Link: end of example 4 section: ht…

Limiting CPU time for a single invocation of a worker is more for catching bugs in code that is using more CPU than expected and is not whatsoever effective as a hard limit on spending...

Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#209

Post by chrisandchris »

ttul wrote: post #107
embedding-shape wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, but what about as a CDN/website-proxy/WAF? I know we don't have the same automated reputation-propagation as with email, but same thing supposedly happens there, where eventually you get turned off if you don't act on lawful requests, which is exactly why Cloudflare is unavailable in Spain during La Liga matches, because Cloudflare don't take piracy streams down. In theory, Cloudflare should take those down, when…

I run an email sending service at scale (billions of messages per month, tens of millions of end users, thousands of customers). Most of our software development and operational effort revolves around abuse mitigation. That has been the case for 15 years. It's a cat-and-mouse game with two different mice: the senders, who are constantly trying to figure out how to get you to deliver their garbage; and the receivers,…

> billions of messages per month

Just tangential, but maybe that is part of the problem, isn't it? Napkin math tells me that esch person in the world receives every month an e-mail from you, and you're obviously just one of hundres of providers, and only half of the population actially has e-mail... I think you get the point.

E-Mail got to the point where it's actually worse then physical mail to some degree. Physical mail at least has a hurdle for the sender, and it's easier to throw away without even looking at it. The amount of low-quality mail and annoying, unnecessary notifications I receive is just at a level where I really think of dropping e-mail except for absolute becessary services.

Re: Cloudflare Email Service

#210

Post by big-and-small »

embedding-shape wrote: post #73
thomas_gauvin wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blog author chiming in here: We have reserved IPs for Email Service and will be protecting the reputation and fighting spam from originating on Email Service. If we did not do so, our IPs would get flagged and then emails end up in spam or not delivered. That defeats the purpose of having a transactional Email Service. We're well aware of this.

Will you also do this for other spammers using Cloudflare infrastructure, or just specifically for this email product? > For years, Spamhaus has observed abusive activity facilitated by Cloudflare’s various services. Cybercriminals have been exploiting these legitimate services to mask activities and enhance their malicious operations, a tactic referred to as living off trusted services (LOTS) [2]. > With 1201 unreso…

Spamhaus itself is a shady and non transparent organization and basically one of reasons why its been so hard to actually run email service for decades.

Cloudflare is not perfect, but at least it been consistent about not becoming censorship service with very few exceptions where they banned something.

Id rather let criminals freely buy and use kitchen knives than let shady organizations control who is allowed to buy one.

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