I have a question. Is this Trump effect or Pentagon would have threatened otherwise too?
Genuine question.
The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
201–210 of 247 posts
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#202Earlier quoted context omitted.
WaPo is reporting that OpenAI and xAI already agreed to the Pentagon's "any lawful use" clause, aka, mass surveillance and fully autonomous killbots. From the WaPo article https://archive.is/yz6JA#selection-435.42-435.355 > Officials say other leading AI firms have gone along with the demand. OpenAI, the maker of ChatGPT, Google and Elon Musk’s xAI have agreed to allow the Pentagon to use their systems for “all lawfu…
> fully autonomous killbots I keep hearing this but it should be plainly obvious to everyone (at least here) that an LLM is not the right AI for this use case. That's like trying to use chatgpt for an airplane autopilot, it doesn't make sense. Other ML models may but not an LLM. Why does the "autonomous killbot" thing keep getting brought up when discussing Anthropic and other llm providers? For reference, "autonomou…
It's almost a silly distinction since ML has been used in weapons for quite a while. For example: Javelin missiles have automatic target recognition, cruise missles have intelligent terrain following, long range drones use algos like SLAM for guidance.
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#203Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It just needs one player to do it, so everyone has to be able to do it. Businesses stay out of potentially profitable market segments for various reasons, so I don't think everyone has to be able to do it to survive.
We are constantly told how the board has a fiduciary responsibility to make investors money to overrule these various reasons.
We’re constantly told all sorts of stuff. It isn’t clear to me at all that this fiduciary duty exists in law at all, more its a collection of precedents and wishful thinking.
Using fiduciary duty as cover for profiting from the misery of others? Well that’s just some modern American doublespeak. I’m consistently asking myself “Are we the Baddies?” and the only answer I have anymore is yes.
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#204Earlier quoted context omitted.
We have fully autonomous weapons, and had them for over a century. We call them "landmines". I expect autonomous weapons of the near future to look somewhat similar to that. They get deployed to an area, attack anything that looks remotely like a target there for a given time, then stand down and return to base. That's it. The job of the autonomous weapon platform isn't telling friend from foe - it's disposing of eve…
You don’t need Anthropic for this use case, so obviously this use case is not what the current fight is about.
You don't need Anthropic for any use case. They don't ship VLAs either - nothing from Anthropic's entire model lineup can run on a killer drone.
Which raises the question: why did the Pentagon try to pressure Anthropic at all?
On the principle of it? Political reasons? Or was the real concern "domestic warrantless surveillance"?
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#205Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is your argument that you're not involved enough in American politics to have responsible opinions about it, even though you're involved enough to comment in the first place? I agree this in isolation is low stakes. The problem is the volume. The memetic assault is everywhere you turn, and propagating it helps the regime. And yes, it's far too easy to do accidentally. That doesn't mean we shouldn't appreciate others…
Is your argument that you're not involved enough in American politics to have responsible opinions about it, even though you're involved enough to comment in the first place? I wonder who or what you're replying to here. Certainly, it has no relation to anything I've said in this thread. That doesn't mean we shouldn't appreciate others calling it out. Again, who are you replying to with this? I said "take it easy", n…
You said "I'm not american" as the lead in to your comment. What was the point of saying this other than to disclaim the responsibility I invoked? (which technically wasn't even directed at you directly)
For the overall argument, you called out a comment for calling out a comment whose only contribution was to promote the term "DOW". If it had been a substantive comment that someone jumped on for merely using the term, you'd have had a reasonable point. But it wasn't.
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#206Earlier quoted context omitted.
We are constantly told how the board has a fiduciary responsibility to make investors money to overrule these various reasons.
We’re constantly told all sorts of stuff. It isn’t clear to me at all that this fiduciary duty exists in law at all, more its a collection of precedents and wishful thinking. Using fiduciary duty as cover for profiting from the misery of others? Well that’s just some modern American doublespeak. I’m consistently asking myself “Are we the Baddies?” and the only answer I have anymore is yes .
agreed. I've never thought that fiduciary duties meant tossing out all morals and considerations of right/wrong to the point that one must make any decision in a way that will make the most money within legal bounds. I'm no economist or lawyer, but I've always taken it that the duty is to not do dumb shit that will lose money and to do things that protect it. The reading of "make money at all cost" just seems like a strained interpretation, yet it's trotted out very frequently with not enough push back.
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#207Earlier quoted context omitted.
We have fully autonomous weapons, and had them for over a century. We call them "landmines". I expect autonomous weapons of the near future to look somewhat similar to that. They get deployed to an area, attack anything that looks remotely like a target there for a given time, then stand down and return to base. That's it. The job of the autonomous weapon platform isn't telling friend from foe - it's disposing of eve…
And the arms industry has been pushing smart mines for decades, so that they can keep selling them despite the really bad long-term consequences (well beyond the end of hostilities) and the Ottawa Treaty ban. In the end, land mines are killing people although the mines are supposed to be sufficiently advanced not to target persons. From a security perspective, the “return to base” part seems rather problematic. I dou…
"Smart mines" specifically can be designed so that they're literally incapable of exploding once a deployment timer expires, or a fixed design time limit is reached.
It just makes the mines themselves more expensive - and landmines are very much a "cheap and cheerful" product.
For most autonomous weapons, the situation is even more favorable. Very few things can pack the power to sit for decades waiting for a chance to strike. Dumb landmines only get there by the virtue of being powered by the enemy.
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#208Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is no such thing. That's a fantasy term used by deluded people to signal a particular virtue.
... signal a particular vice . It's vice signalling . We generally think of war as bad and try to avoid it, most especially the people tasked with fighting said wars . Nothing has changed about the performative-ness, in fact if anything it's gotten more performative and hollow. They just signal vices rather than virtues, so a bunch of rightist-flavored-Lenin's useful idiots think it is fresh or effective or anti-"wok…
Ah, yes, the Orwellian newspeak that is the phrase "Department of Defense" is something worth protecting. What next, the Ministry of Truth?
I don't really give any weight to what a leftist considers a vice or a virtue.
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#209Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not either of those. Anthropic put a lot of effort into getting FedRAMP approved so the DOD could use them; they are now being punished for that, and the government at present has no other good options. Other options could of course be developed, but other vendors may question how unreliable and untrustworthy the current DOD leadership is as as customer.
> DOD *DOW
Is over $50,000, all arguments are invalid.
Re: The Pentagon is making a mistake by threatening Anthropic
#210My belief is they are terrified of China and this seems evident when you take into account the moves they're making with Venezuela, Iran, and the increased adoption of authoritarian tactics. We're trying to play catch-up with China's rapid rise as a super-power and the AI infrastructure is one of the few major developments we still have control over, for now. I sympathize with Dario, he's stuck in a very bad position…
If they are terrified of China why aren't they doing more diplomacy or at minimum, not allow NVIDIA to sell their chips to them? Sorry but the China scare tactics is just more cold war nonsense. The idea China as a serious threat to anyone in the world where you have the USA invading countries (invading Iraq based on lies), kidnapping Presidents (Venezula), assassinating various leaders (drone strikes), abusing democ…
Diplomacy is too slow in the eyes of this administration, that's why we're in this predicament. It's not cold war nonsense nor is it anything new; our military and intelligence agencies have been working against China via geopolitical proxy wars long before the Trump administration. This is just a natural extension of the Peter Thiel "remove all bureaucracy, we're not moving fast enough" strategy.