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ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

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Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#201

Post by jacquesm »

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #127
uwagar wrote: post #52

[flagged]

ICE is normalizing police hiding behind masks. ICE is normalizing violating people's (hard fought and won in the Supreme Court) 1st amendment right to film the police, so that ICE can do their work in secret. ICE is using biometrics on people who have not broken any law, then saying the federal government will be doing whatever it can in its power to penalize those people now that they have been identified as doing..…

The stormtroopers in Star Wars look like they do to be some kind of extreme in anonymous abuse of power. Their squeaky clean white exterior is literally a whitewash of that abuse. That's the one trick that ICE could still pull to complete the transition.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#202

Post by Kim_Bruning »

jacquesm wrote: post #198
Kim_Bruning wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sympathize with your situation, and I'm not calling you a monster. But "I had no choice, I had people depending on me" is the exact reasoning that has enabled every atrocity carried out by ordinary people; it's the banality of evil. None of the individual acts seem evil. Conducting a census isn't evil. Collating the data isn't evil. Arresting people with the wrong papers isn't necessarily evil. Driving a train isn'…

> That's a famous Vernichtungslager, and that's not true yet. But it may well become true soon.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46897620

From the angle of your 2015 post, I can at least see where you're coming from. Modern adtech is much more granular and up to date than a census ever was.

And hopefully the worst case can be prevented.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#203

Post by donkeybeer »

somenameforme wrote: post #146
mmoustafa wrote: post #79

Why do all the discussion posts about ICE’s biometric app get taken down? Although they may invite politicing, they are very relevant to HN. e.g [flagged] Target director's Global Entry was revoked after ICE used app to scan her face [ https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46833871 ]

[flagged]

What is "extremist" about "sabotage"? These are private companies and private individuals, they can choose whether to or not to interact with ICE. Unless its a part of some formal investigation there is nothing criminal or extreme about providing whatever data or response or lack thereof to them. Or do you not believe in freedom of association and free speech?

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#204

Post by reactordev »

dns_snek wrote: post #117
andsoitis wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you support what’s happening. I don’t know that things are that black and white. Do you feel the same about the billions of consumers who buy and use the products these companies make?

No because employees are making the actual thing that inflicts harm while consumers' actions are completely diffused and many steps removed from the harm they cause. That's why ad-tech is so effective in the first place. Consumer pays $1.10 for a can of coke, $0.10 of that goes to ad-tech, the consumer watches some coke ads, ad-tech pays $0.05 to the publisher and the consumer receives $0.05 in benefits in the form o…

Replace “tech” in this scenario with “ammunition”.

Does your argument still hold up?

>”employees are making the actual thing that inflicts harm while consumers' actions are completely diffused and many steps removed from the harm they cause.”

“employees are making the actual thing that inflicts harm while consumers' actions directly cause deadly harm.”

I’m not arguing that we shouldn’t be voting with our wallets and supporting these people but your initial argument is flawed. They produce goods precisely because consumers buy them…

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#205

Post by torben-friis »

nosianu wrote: post #140
AlecSchueler wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "have no immigration enforcement and permanently halt deportations” is also unacceptable? The latter seems to be the solution being pushed by one party. What party? What makes it "seem" that way? Could you link to anyone calling for this?

Those using memes along the lines of "nobody is illegal" (sometimes "on stolen land" is added)? This is a movement not limited to the US. Here in Europe there is a similar movement, using that same slogan. They don't want any borders or border enforcement at all. Merely for illustration, a single example: https://abc7.com/post/protests-expected-socal-part-nationwid... > Protesters were seen carrying flags, signs and…

>"nobody is illegal"

This is completely orthogonal to the conversation, but I think you misunderstood that slogan. It does not mean “immigration rules must not be enforced”.

It means differentiating between a potentially illegal action (illegal entry/overstaying) and the person itself. You never talk about an illegal driver, or an illegal drinker, but people talk about illegal immigrants, with the implication that the person itself is illegal.

It’s subtle but it’s a step towards dehumanizing a person, or making infractions to their rights “count less” in the public eye.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#206

Post by [deleted] »

jacquesm wrote: post #167
maldev wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Not only that, but your profile clearly says you aren't even American. Maybe you should focus on your own politics, or things you understand, and not try to threaten people. I'm not threatening anybody, I'm just pointing out that in the aggregate anonymity does not exist as told by TFA whereas the GP seems to believe it holds some weight. The only reason you are able to write your comment is simply because I'm not…

[deleted]

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#207

Post by lukan »

dns_snek wrote: post #117
andsoitis wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you support what’s happening. I don’t know that things are that black and white. Do you feel the same about the billions of consumers who buy and use the products these companies make?

No because employees are making the actual thing that inflicts harm while consumers' actions are completely diffused and many steps removed from the harm they cause. That's why ad-tech is so effective in the first place. Consumer pays $1.10 for a can of coke, $0.10 of that goes to ad-tech, the consumer watches some coke ads, ad-tech pays $0.05 to the publisher and the consumer receives $0.05 in benefits in the form o…

"The only way for consumers to avoid this "

Or they could stop drinking coke? But I guess that is too much to ask.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#208

Post by throwawayqqq11 »

maldev wrote: post #177
defrost wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, unless you're violating your visa and breaking American laws. You wouldn't have gotten shot in the face at a protest in America. The women shot in the face by an ICE agent was not "violating her visa", nor was she violating American laws by being halted for a short time across a single lane with traffic passing her by. She was given conflicting instructions by two agents, and was within her rights to leave as…

[flagged]

Since i cant reply to your flagged comment above, ill do it here.

> And I gotta ask, you think it's just two oceans, and what your experience is in the intelligence community field? Are you just assuming without knowing the inner workings?

This depicts the distribution of refugees caused by iraq and afghan wars. Which, to remind you, were proudly based on lies.

> https://www.unhcr.org/news/press-releases/iraqis-afghans-and...

> As a region, Europe received 75 percent of all asylum applications although the United States remained the single largest recipient country with an estimated 13 percent of all applications

Are you still proud making the world a better place? Maybe you are too busy fighting terrorists to reply.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#209

Post by saubeidl »

xp84 wrote: post #125
Paracompact wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some people have absolutist takes on these sorts of things. If the stated purpose makes sense ("stop illegal immigration"), they will dismiss tragedies as routine accidents of an imperfect world. If they have no sense of when exceptions become intolerable and course-correction becomes necessary, then by definition, no amount of evidence will change their mind.

What if we believe that those shootings are completely unacceptable (probably criminal), but that “have no immigration enforcement and permanently halt deportations” is also unacceptable? The latter seems to be the solution being pushed by one party. Like always, the left’s problem is that their proposed solutions read like they were written by teenagers, based on emotions and dismissive of the reasons why their supp…

ICE as an institution is fundamentally evil.

It's using immigration as a pretext to build an unaccountable group of thugs that disappear people into camps, murder political opponents and surveil the populace (as seen in OP). It's recruiting primarily from far-right militias, regularizing them into a paramilitary force of the regime.

There is no justifiable reason to have them terrorize an entire city like they have been doing in Minneapolis.

The brownshirts needed to be abolished in the 1920s, a pinky-swear they wouldn't do the thing they were designed to do wouldn't have been enough.

The same applies to their modern equivalent.

Re: ICE seeks industry input on ad tech location data for investigative use

#210

Post by account42 »

viraptor wrote: post #55

Since there's quite a few people here working at US companies with access to lots of user data, but they may not have decision making capacity, I just thought I'll link the Simple Sabotage Field Manual, out of context and for no reason at all https://www.cia.gov/static/5c875f3ec660e092cf893f60b4a288df/... If some data is shared with an external entity, it likely needs to be included in a few usual disclaimers, with a…

Might I suggest to instead reflect on why you are working in an industry that collects all this data.
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