I'm returning my Framework 16 • Hacker News Board

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#201

Post by YorickPeterse » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:44 PM UTC

emeril wrote: post #176

can't he just replace the keyboard? I'd imagine that won't be too hard?

Did you miss the following parts?

    Given my past experiences with X1 Carbon laptops breaking outside of warranty and the frustration that comes with replacing their components, I decided it was time to look for a replacement.
    [...]
    There are also some other issues with the X1 line in general, such as poor CPU cooling and the absolute nightmare that is opening them up to replace parts or clean them properly.

Maintaining an X1 is certainly possible, but it's incredibly frustrating and based on my past experiences with this series I strongly suspect other components will also fail in the near future.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#202

Post by kelnos » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:48 PM UTC

Frotag wrote: post #49

I have a Framework 16 from one of the early batches (2023, think it was ~1000usd). > Not only does [the spacers] look weird, you can also feel the gap and edges when resting your palm on them ... and the edges are quite sharp. If you have arm hairs you may consider shaving them off or risk getting them stuck. I also suspect gunk will build up in these edges over time. > There's also a practical problem: due to the fl…

> Tangent but the new intel ultra cpus (the ones that end with V) have amazing battery life.

Framework seems to offer the "H" variants only, though. Looking at specs, the "V" variants appear much lower performance and less capable. (Maybe a good trade off, but... YMMV.)

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#203

Post by KennyBlanken » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:49 PM UTC

> Since I use my laptop for programming and often use it in low light conditions such as a living room with dimmed lights in the evening, OLED just doesn't make sense.

What? Low light is ideal for OLED compared to most LCDs where in low light contrast is poor due to bleed-through on the black areas via the backlight. The problem here isn't the laptop, it's between the keyboard and chair.

> I narrowed it down to two options: Buy a refurbished M1 or M2 Macbook and run Asahi Linux Buy a Framework

...or stop being a dogmatic baby about your OS and run MacOS, which is infinitely better than Linux as a desktop OS?

> I looked at some other brands but it appears that in 2025 there's just aren't many good options for Linux users

A market of less than 1% has terrible options? *gasp*

The only people still using Linux on desktop are people who think that *twenty five years* into "the year of the linux desktop" this will be the year that Linux doesn't stop being the worst option for a desktop OS.

If 2/3rds of the current linux distros hung up the hat and went to go help with other distros, there _might_ actually be progress on this front - but the nerds are too interested in fighting over asinine personal preference type things nobody else cares about, to actually make a distro that works properly and reliably. The Linux world is so hopelessly fragmented and there's thousands of people doing the same work as at least 6 other people all because they think their particular way of installing a linux package is better or their file layout is best.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#204

Post by debo_ » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:49 PM UTC

markus_zhang wrote: post #186

debo_ wrote: post #10

Author doesn't cite how they decided that only MacBook or Framework would fit their needs. I've never had trouble with Dell laptops with any Linux distro I cared about. If I wanted a powerful Linux laptop, I'd probably look at something like Dell's premium model: https://www.dell.com/en-ca/shop/laptops-ultrabooks/dell-16-p...

I bought a few refurbished Dell laptops/desktops in recent years, and while older models hold fine, more recent models broke down quite easily within a year. Sure all of them are refurbished models (purchased through official website) that cost from $400 CAD to $800 CAD but I'm sketchy of the build quality of recent models.

Good to know. My most recent is from 2021 and it holds up quite well.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#205

Post by markus_zhang » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:54 PM UTC

debo_ wrote: post #204

markus_zhang wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I bought a few refurbished Dell laptops/desktops in recent years, and while older models hold fine, more recent models broke down quite easily within a year. Sure all of them are refurbished models (purchased through official website) that cost from $400 CAD to $800 CAD but I'm sketchy of the build quality of recent models.

Good to know. My most recent is from 2021 and it holds up quite well.

What model did you buy? Was it a new one? I'm looking for anything that can live up to 5+ years. I have seen all kinds of issues, and the most frustrating thing is, most of the issues are small but deal-breaking.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#206

Post by IshKebab » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:56 PM UTC

justin66 wrote: post #94

comte7092 wrote: post #8

I appreciate the authors thoughtful review here, but I can’t help but be frustrated by the constant lack of understanding of the core value proposition of framework both in this post and in many comments here on hn. Frequently the author brings up that for 2,000 euros they expect a premium experience, but no where is there an evaluation of the value granted by upgradability and repeatability of the machine, and only…

> I think ultimately what frustrates me is that people don’t consider the ability to repair or upgrade your machine part of a “premium” experience, but that’s is just something I have to accept. I think it is unfortunate that our consumerist culture places so little value on it though. Buying one of the original Frameworks and a Macbook Air at roughly the same time made me realize how little I actually care about upg…

Yeah I agree. You can get two base MacBook Airs for the price of that laptop. A base MacBook Air is a very very capable machine.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#207

Post by orthecreedence » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:58 PM UTC

I'm on a Framework 13. Aside from the wretched 4:3 screen size (which I knew in advance, it was a tradeoff, but my god I miss 16:10) I really do like it. No battery issues, the thing is incredibly fast. I've had the pleasure of repairing parts of it (screen, keyboard) and it has been super easy. The touchpad's button click could be a little more "tuned" (I miss physical separate buttons), but that's my only functional gripe.

But seriously, make a 14" 16:10 Framework please. I will buy a new one just for that.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#208

Post by MarsIronPI » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:59 PM UTC

cosmic_cheese wrote: post #182

comte7092 wrote: post #8

I appreciate the authors thoughtful review here, but I can’t help but be frustrated by the constant lack of understanding of the core value proposition of framework both in this post and in many comments here on hn. Frequently the author brings up that for 2,000 euros they expect a premium experience, but no where is there an evaluation of the value granted by upgradability and repeatability of the machine, and only…

The crux of the matter is that even if one values upgradability and repairability, neither is a frequent need for practically anybody. Reliable machines rarely need repairs outside of owner mistreatment, and most people I know who are technically capable enough to care about upgrading generally do it maybe once every 4-6 years, by which point hardware has usually advanced far enough that buying a new laptop is easy t…

This. My idea of a repairable laptop is the Thinkpads up until around 2015. And I absolutely agree that the port modules forces Framework to limit the number of ports to the point that I'd hesitate to purchase one because I'd be swapping ports all the time.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#209

Post by IshKebab » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:59 PM UTC

Octoth0rpe wrote: post #65

piskov wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> replacing a stick of ram How often does your RAM fail you?

The use case is to replace an existing working stick with a higher capacity stick, not just for repairs.

How often are you actually going to do that though? My desktop from 12 years ago has 16GB of RAM and Apple only just upgraded their base specs to 16GB.

Ok granted my new desktops have 128GB, but that's massive overkill so I can have like 12 VSCode's open. For normal people 16GB has been the sensible amount for at least a decade.

Re: I'm returning my Framework 16

#210

Post by daviddever23box » Wed, Dec 24, 2025, 10:59 PM UTC

YorickPeterse wrote: post #140

cdev_gl wrote: post #91

I can't speak to the rest of the text or the laptops themselves, but as someone who works with color reproducibility in video and print, those photos comparing colors of two different screens are worse than useless. Uncalibrated screens photographed at different angles in different lighting conditions are not a valid basis for comparison. If you want properly calibrated displays, you need to purchase hardware (dataco…

The photos are just meant to illustrate the difference to the reader, not to be anything scientific. Of course manual calibration is ideal, but having a somewhat sensible default calibration isn't much to ask for and is in fact something many other laptops do just fine.

Problem is, display profile support for Wayland has been, at best, spotty until recently - and, there should be multiple accurate targets available on any good display panel.

My factory-seconds F13 (using 11th-gen Intel, still the best in terms of power savings) shipped with the older glossy display, which had a known, disclosed-as-cheaper LUT issue at lower brightness settings. After a couple of calibration rounds, it is spot-on and my go-to PC laptop.

Decent keyboard, too.

Of course, things are often more expensive in Europe (compared to the US) for zero good reason, so the F16 will always be at a proportional disadvantage compared to the F13. You may find that a much better fit.