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Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

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Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#201

Post by bit1993 »

johnebgd wrote: post #100
slg wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The patent system. I know someone will respond detailing why the patent system is pro-business, but it is objectively government regulation that puts restrictions on new technology, so it's proof that regulation of that sort is at least an American tradition if not fully an "American value".

Patents and trademarks are the only ways to create legal monopolies. They are/were intended to reward innovation but despite good intentions are abused.

Patents, trademarks, copyright, deeds and other similar concepts are part of what makes capitalism what it is, without them capitalism will not work because they are the mechanisms that enforce private property.

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#202

Post by conartist6 »

rubyfan wrote: post #34

Is it me or does this seem like naked corruption at its worst? These tech CEOs hang out at the White House and donate to superfluous causes and suddenly the executive is protecting their interests. This does nothing to protect working US citizens from AI alien (agents) coming to take their jobs and displace their incomes.

I'm in agreement because what is there to say about AI policy?

This govt clearly isn't going to regulate against harms like perpetuating systems of racism. This government adores to perpetuate systems of racism.

So fuck it. Let's race to the bottom like the companies want to so badly.

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#203

Post by matusp »

N_Lens wrote: post #108
IncreasePosts wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But humans aren't more productive for the most part. What had made people more productive is, for the most part, mechanization, computerization, and other tech tree improvements. Even though everyone didn't get rich from the industrial revolution, ultimately people led easier lives, more stuff, and less work.

I read that a peasant in the middle ages typically worked less and had much more leisure than a worker in the 21st century.

You can achieve medieval peasent level of life quality by not working at all these days.

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#204

Post by thrance »

parineum wrote: post #183
Refreeze5224 wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know where you get the confidence that any of that matters to SCOTUS. They know their role, and they are playing.

SCOTUS has ruled against Trump numerous times.

But they rule in his favor more often than not. They gave him freaking immunity for any crimes he may commit. This alone enables him to disregard the law without any fear of repercussions.

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#205

Post by true_religion »

XenophileJKO wrote: post #174
rubyfan wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We regulate medicine, nuclear technology, television, movies, monopolies, energy, financial services, etc. because these things can be harmful if left solely to the market. Americans value honest work, dignity, prosperity and equal opportunity. Innovation is useful in so far as it enables our values - regulation is not counter to Americans interests, it protects them.

I feel like anyone making this argument hasn't studied how those regulations happened. They ALL happened AFTER people got hurt. That's how we do things here. We always have. It's kind of messed up, but the alternative is a bunch of rules on things that wouldn't be a real problem.

Who got hurt before the US banned the export of cryptography?

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#206

Post by hvb2 »

ETH_start wrote: post #179
hvb2 wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Higher productivity is also why jobs pay so much more in the U.S. than the E.U. You mean the top tier jobs or the bottom 90%? They pay so much more because the US is very ok with big income inequality. Those unions represent a much bigger share of the population, so shouldn't they have more away in a democratic system (where demos is people)

Median income and the purchasing power of disposable income are substantially higher in the U.S. The public sector unions do represent a much larger share of the population than the CEOs but in absolute terms public sector workers constitute a very small share of the population, while receiving a large share of public spending. Given they are being rewarded with huge amounts of tax dollars from the party they help ke…

> but in absolute terms public sector workers constitute a very small share of the population, while receiving a large share of public spending

Uh... Just no? Public spending? That's défense, health care, entitlements etcetera etcetera

I'll actually back it up with some numbers too:

> That’s 1% of gross domestic product, and almost 5% of total federal spending. The government payroll for other developed countries is typically 5% of GDP, Kettl said.

From: https://www.marketplace.org/story/2025/03/06/federal-workers...

And this

> Median income and the purchasing power of disposable income are substantially higher in the U.S.

Not sure what you're basing that on but there's this too > The statistic is used to show how unequal things have become in the U.S.: Some 40% of Americans would struggle to come up with even $400 to pay for an unexpected bill

From: https://www.minneapolisfed.org/article/2021/what-a-400-dolla...

So unless they're all spending money irrationally, they have no money to save meaning little or no disposable income

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#207

Post by Dumblydorr »

oceanplexian wrote: post #79
rubyfan wrote: post #34

Is it me or does this seem like naked corruption at its worst? These tech CEOs hang out at the White House and donate to superfluous causes and suddenly the executive is protecting their interests. This does nothing to protect working US citizens from AI alien (agents) coming to take their jobs and displace their incomes.

> This does nothing to protect working US citizens from AI alien (agents) coming to take their jobs and displace their incomes. Where did you get the idea that banning new technology that could eliminate jobs is even remotely an American value? Going back to the Industrial Revolution the United States has been 100% gas pedal all the time on innovation and disruption, which has in turn created millions of jobs that di…

Not true that US is 100% gas pedal constantly on innovation. You’re forgetting labor reform movements and the service switch away from industry in the last few decades. Also the de-science-ing of the current admin has vastly reduced our innovative capacity, as well as the virtual decapitation of brain drain. Those next generation of brightest immigrants certainly aren’t coming here to deal with ICE, and that’s been the source of half the great minds in our country throughout its history, gone because of racism.

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#208

Post by rokoss21 »

The regulation vs innovation framing is a false dichotomy here. Most developed economies have found that thoughtful regulation enables _sustainable_ innovation - see GDPR and data privacy innovation, or pharma regulations driving R&D.

For AI specifically, baseline standards around model documentation, data sourcing transparency, and compute auditing would actually help larger players (who can afford compliance) and reduce race-to-bottom dynamics that harm smaller developers.

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#209

Post by IanCal »

hvb2 wrote: post #206
ETH_start wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Median income and the purchasing power of disposable income are substantially higher in the U.S. The public sector unions do represent a much larger share of the population than the CEOs but in absolute terms public sector workers constitute a very small share of the population, while receiving a large share of public spending. Given they are being rewarded with huge amounts of tax dollars from the party they help ke…

> but in absolute terms public sector workers constitute a very small share of the population, while receiving a large share of public spending Uh... Just no? Public spending? That's défense, health care, entitlements etcetera etcetera I'll actually back it up with some numbers too: > That’s 1% of gross domestic product, and almost 5% of total federal spending. The government payroll for other developed countries is…

Disposable income is essentially just income after tax. It’s the amount you have where you get to direct where it goes / how you dispose of it. It’s not money after essentials.

There are many ways to slice it but the US median income is high.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposable_household_and_per_c...

Re: Ensuring a National Policy Framework for Artificial Intelligence

#210

Post by throw0101a »

sterlind wrote: post #73
cdrnsf wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EOs also aren't laws, they're instructions on how to execute policy. This administration treats them as the former. Everything they do, however, is petty, cruel and nakedly corrupt while also being marred by a total lack of competence.

I think the Administration is likely to get its toys taken away soon. the Major Questions Doctrine, the end of Chevron deference, the mandate for Article III courts from Jarkesy , have been building towards this for a while. the capstone in this program of weakening the administrative state, overturning Humphrey's Executor when Trump v. Slaughter is decided, will likely revive the Intelligible Principle Doctrine, as…

> I think the Administration is likely to get its toys taken away soon.

Perhaps worth reading "The umpire who picked a side: John Roberts and the death of rule of law in America":

* https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2025/aug/...

Also "John Roberts and the Cynical Cult of Federalist No. 70":

* https://newrepublic.com/article/204334/john-roberts-federali...

And "This Is All John Roberts’ Fault":

* https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2025/11/john-roberts-do...

And perhaps "Trump Allies Sue John Roberts To Give White House Control Of Court System":

* https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-allies-sue-john-rob...

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