Why is this post allowed but this one[1] (40 points, 84 comments) is flagged and buried?
[1] New research highlights a shortage of male mentors for boys and young men
Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
201–210 of 304 posts
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#202One reason I like CBS’s Elementary’s depiction of Sherlock (maybe more so than BBC’s Sherlock) is because how Elementary treats Sherlock’s mental health and addiction recovery as central to the character. As great as Sherlock is at solving cases, he still struggles greatly to handle his own mental health and addiction recovery, which makes him more grounded to earth.
> Sherlock’s mental health and addiction recovery As I said downthread..... In Conan Doyle's books, Holmes was a user of cocaine, not an addict. This modern desire to portray Holmes as a drug addict says far more about our own times.
A few things; one, even if it's not strictly speaking true that cocaine use always leads to addiction every single time, we know now better than in Victorian era England how often it does, and Doyle not having been a cocaine user may have lost some of the elements of how cocaine is addictive and what it looks like. I hate to say that there is some moral duty to show a protagonist using cocaine as having a problem with its use that needs to be overcome, but I do think it'd be strange too to keep what was effectively this SMBC comic (https://smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=191) as Holmes' use of coke.
Secondly, the stories that mention coke use are all written from the perspective of Holmes' best friend, who we'd expect to be biased towards writing about his friend in a positive light. I don't think this is accidental. Watson quotes him effectively saying "I just do coke because life is so mundane and boring, and not stimulating enough for me" which is nearly the exact same justification and thought process used by like, every addict and if not a word-for-word quote, then at least very similar for Chris Moltisanti's justification of his own addiction to Tony Soprano.
It may not be an exact rendering of what was in the books but it is extremely natural modification to make, where otherwise we'd have flat Marty Stu character who is talking in ways that seem very consistent with at least problematic use and yet who's not addicted. "Our own times" have dealt with at least 100 years of coke addiction, 50 years of crack so maybe we're just not naive enough to believe that a guy who's saying "my friend just takes it when he's bored, but he's bored all the time because his mind is too sharp for this dull world" isn't a problematic user or addict.
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#203I've read a lot of Holmes recently, and while I'm not a man, I do think Doyle portrays Holmes' issues in a way that is relatable. Holmes core thing though is that he has an almost ADHD-esque craving for novelty and tolerance for risk taking. He also can't stand not actively working on things, and when he's not working is when he's depressed. He doesn't seem to know how to actually feel good, but he knows how to be us…
> ...when he's not working is when he's depressed.
Holmes, being an exceptionally observant man, definitely would observe that walks raise the mood, allow for (most often silly) ideas to come and, last but not least, increase observation capabilities, attention to details and speed of thought.
Arthur Conan-Doyle did an extensive walks back then, but his hero was written to not to. This is not right.
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#204Earlier quoted context omitted.
I also spend what feels to me like a lot of time here. I like it, despite its problems. But HN isn't good enough to deserve to be 70% of anyone's life. :(
I agree, but it's 12:10 PM, and I am in my third meeting, pretending to pay attention. I wish the job market improved.
I feel that. I wish the same.
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#205I wonder how much of it is just Arthur Conon Doyle hating his character. Which has was known for as the stories progressed. He even killed him, just to resurrect him later because of public demand.
He accumulated character flaws along the way, as if Doyle wanted to make Holmes as unsympathetic as he could without changing his core traits.
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#206Earlier quoted context omitted.
Where is this happening? The whole point is calling them “mental health problems” infers there is something systematically wrong with them as opposed to the obvious result of putting men in modern society.
> ...loneliness and depression... > All entirely standard male behaviors
> putting loneliness and depression on a pedestal here
Where is this happening?
Pointing out something is entirely normal, standard and expected is in not putting it on a pedestal.
You want to condemn them too, and I won’t. Their manifestation is a sign of other problems, as shown through history, and to paint them as mental illness is a way to avoid the other problems.
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#207Earlier quoted context omitted.
I guess that would depend on the partner? And what do you mean by vulnerability in that context that would make her lose respect? And what do you mean by wrong times or reasons?
Most people seek emotional support, resilience and trustworthiness from their partner, and being excessively "vulnerable" can definitely hinder you from playing that role effectively. This is what can sometimes be experienced as a loss of respect. What you really want is to show a mere modicum of emotional vulnerability that your partner can then have some opportunity to empathize with, and not view you as overly bri…
Why would I seek emotional support from someone so disconnected from their emotions they can't show more than a "modicum" of vulnerability?
How could I trust someone's resilience when they don't show they've been through things that built that resilience, and demonstrate it?
How can I trust someone who so closely monitors how much and what sort of emotions to show to me?
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#208Earlier quoted context omitted.
Right I forgot we are on HN where we even need a scientific paper on "do women like weak vulnerable or strong confident men?" because nobody ever goes outside.
I bet that people who advocate for showing "vulnerability" are modeling this as a facet of strong confidence, and not opposed to it. But the thing is, if you really have reached the level of effortless confidence where that's a realistic prospect, you won't need that advice! You'll just be able to intuitively calibrate how much "vulnerability" to allow others, as a direct outcome of that strong emotional stability. M…
Was I just described not only as "effortlessly confident" but also "emotionally stable"?
That's new. My crippling depressing and social anxiety will be glad to hear it!
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#209Earlier quoted context omitted.
I neither like the taboo nor the opposite. Too much psychology talk in every day life, everyone is traumatised and has unresolved issues etc. That may be, but I wish we would handle it all more privately...
I deeply dislike the inherent ideology of psychology. Liberalism, the idea of a health individual does not pay any idea to the shared whole, suffering which may be "noble" for the common good and rights and privileges awarded for suffering in such. I find such a ideologically loaded construct and the inherent biases (idealizations and an inability to talk about the cultural framework and tradeoffs) quite unhelpful fo…
There is not an inherent ideology to psychology, and I'm not sure what you mean by statements such as "the idea of a health individual does not pay any idea to the shared whole" (not even judging; I actually don't know what you mean).
Re: Arthur Conan Doyle explored men’s mental health through Sherlock Holmes
#210> One of those taboo subjects was male vulnerability and mental health problems. (emphasis is mine) I would argue that still in 2025 this is an extreme and institutionalized taboo.
That's right. I built and released a game called Autism Simulator recently. Online feedback was overwhelmingly positive but with plenty of gaslighting sprinkled in, e.g. "everybody's a bit autistic", "that just sounds like working in tech". Minimization is always the default go-to for men's mental health issues.
In the instance of your simulator, I think this is moreso due to the popular idea that people in tech tend to be autistic and the cultural desire to be part of the ingroup, rather than a snub at autistic people/men.