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The disguised return of EU Chat Control

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Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#201

Post by Muromec »

realusername wrote: post #155
karhuton wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

”2 There shall be no interference by a public authority with the exercise of this right EXCEPT such as is in accordance with the law and is necessary in a democratic society in the interests of national security, public safety or the economic well-being of the country, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others.” Are we r…

It depends the version of the declaration, the french one has zero exception listed.

ECHR is a convention with a court hearing the cases, as opposed to declarations which is just good vibes PR. Of course the actual working instrument has loopholes.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#202

Post by wmf »

Cupprum wrote: post #179

I sort of hope someone will leak all private information about Peter Hummelgaard. He is one of the people behind this proposal, just so he would get a taste of his own medicine.

That would only "prove" that government officials should be exempt from government surveillance.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#204

Post by ntoskrnl_exe »

klabb3 wrote: post #137

This can backfire bigly for the EU. The whole union is sustained on shared values and interests. Sneaking in surveillance is extremely offputting for the sentiment towards EU in many circles. Every member state has plenty of skeptics who want to brexit and this is gasoline for them. And rightly so. This isn’t a fluke from some misinformed non-technical stray politician who ”wants to save the children” (yes, they exis…

This legislation has a potential to "radicalize" a lot of people. I don't agree with many of the decisions by the EU, but at the end of the day the pros do outweigh the cons and in a hypothetical Brexit-like referendum I wouldn't consider agreeing with leaving.

If this passes, however, the pencil in my hand would definitely hover above the YES checkbox for a while and, actually, maybe even tick it. This alone would be enough of a straw to break the camel's back.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#205

Post by mszcz »

wmf wrote: post #202
Cupprum wrote: post #179

I sort of hope someone will leak all private information about Peter Hummelgaard. He is one of the people behind this proposal, just so he would get a taste of his own medicine.

That would only "prove" that government officials should be exempt from government surveillance.

Isn’t it (ChatControl) also „marketed” as „safe and secure”? If they (politicians) don’t have their comms backdoored and still get their data stolen, then why would I trust them to secure (read „safely snoop on”) mine or even know what they’re talking about?

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#206

Post by pokot0 »

binary132 wrote: post #58
pokot0 wrote: post #40

Honestly I think privacy is lost. Regardless of what side you were (big fan of privacy here) I feel we have nothing to do but move on and think how to live in a world without privacy. I never wanted privacy anyway: I wanted no discrimination, inclusion, healthy democracy, etc, etc. Privacy has always been a tool for me. At this point, selective privacy like we are experiencing today (we cannot know what’s in the epst…

what a ludicrously insane take. how can you not believe in privacy? do you think what you do in your home should be private, or do you think it’s fine for someone to put cameras in there? If you do, please feel free to invite them to do so; do not feel free to invite them to put cameras in my home.

Privacy for me is not that important. I have nothing to hide, nothing I am ashamed of. For me it's more of a way of protecting from abuse that a need of its own. I realize it's just me and I do advocate for privacy, but if you look around: we lost. Our data is everywhere and there are no consequences whatsoever. PS: I did mention in my original comment that Google and many others already send drones with cameras to spy on your backyard and that is considered "fine". I am not inviting them to come to your house; they are already doing it. Just check Google Maps.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#207

Post by Am4TIfIsER0ppos »

pcrh wrote: post #53

The right to privacy is enshrined in the European Convention on Human Rights, article 8 [0]. It escapes me how politicians can repeatedly attempt to violate this. [0] https://fra.europa.eu/en/law-reference/european-convention-h...

Gotta find those with illegal opinions somehow.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#208

Post by 0dayz »

squigz wrote: post #167
dmix wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU and European parliaments are very much on the technocracy side, where they defer to experts and studies for everything instead of focusing on the popular interests of the public https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technocracy

Look at America to see what happens when things are decided based on the popular interests vs actual data and expertise.

One does not take out the other, balance is always the best.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#209

Post by pokot0 »

binary132 wrote: post #193
iso1631 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whether you or I want it or not is irrelevant Over the last 5000 years it's been very rare for plebs to have any privacy. For a brief period from ww2 through to the early 21st century power shifted to the plebs, but since the 1980s that power has shifted back to the feudal barons, and our rights will eventually regress. But the SP500 will be at record highs so everyone will be told they should be happy.

What I’m taking issue with is that you said you never really cared about privacy. I care about my family’s privacy. I’m not asking you to care about yours. I’m sorry you’ve given up on something that wasn’t important to you anyway, or whatever.

I think you misunderstood him for me. Regardless, giving up is not something I mentioned. You guys just inferred it. I just feel we need to approach the battle very differently. What we have been doing it's not working.

Re: The disguised return of EU Chat Control

#210

Post by squigz »

0dayz wrote: post #208
squigz wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at America to see what happens when things are decided based on the popular interests vs actual data and expertise.

One does not take out the other, balance is always the best.

I agree; that's just not the impression I got from GP.
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