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French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

bbc.com

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Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#201

Post by someuser2345 »

greatgib wrote: post #146

Something really scary in France right now is that you can see really clearly how most mainstream media are used for propaganda. Since a few days, there is an abundance of cover and articles in most major newspaper here with propaganda and repeated lies supporting him. It's hard to imagine but non stop. You have everyday interviews of his family saying that it is an injustice, that he did nothing, that the judgement…

> Using a prepaid line opened with a fake name...

Sorry, why is this such a big deal?

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#202

Post by lostlogin »

philipallstar wrote: post #189
thih9 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You skipped the “take responsibility”. In case of a more serious crime a simple apology is indeed not enough. But it should still be possible to proceed with something more productive for everyone than putting the perpetrator behind bars. As you say, there are many options.

Take responsibility is just a euphemism, though. For some people that is someone going behind bars. What do you actually mean?

Apply the same thought process to ‘punishment’. Those who spend a lot of time in prison seem to come out worse and reoffend.

How is that helpful?

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#203

Post by thelastgallon »

baggachipz wrote: post #187

Imagine, a land full of mother sauces, divine cuisine and pastries, and a corrupt and sentenced felon actually facing (eventual) justice for the crimes they committed. This sounds like a magical land (all is relative).

Even the food in prison should be good? Croissants, etc made by french chefs? There might be another french revolution if they import cooks from america, russia or north korea just for people in prison.

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#204

Post by wisty »

Tepix wrote: post #138
tauwauwau wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Law doesn't seek to punish but to rehabilitate. Act of taking freedom away from the criminal is violent enough. Treating them badly is just a sign of unfair/poor society that cannot maintain (afford to keep) it's promise to be civil to all citizens.

> Law doesn't seek to punish but to rehabilitate. That's unfortunately not universally true. This is most obvious when considering the death penalty. Norway exemplifies a rehabilitative justice model and it is effective, evidenced by low recidivism rates.

Maybe Norway prisons are just really nasty. No drugs, no fights, no conflict with the wardens, just boredom and then solitary confinement if you do anything that's "not OK".

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#205

Post by SirMaster »

n4r9 wrote: post #152
rat9988 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Law doesn't seek to punish Then who is tasked with delivering justice to the victims?

Must justice include punishment? If someone hits me, I'd much rather they take responsibility, apologise, and work on themselves to become a better person, than simply get locked up for a while.

If the only repercussion for assault is they need to apologize and "work on themselves", then what's stopping more people from committing assault? There needs to be punishment.

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#206

Post by kzrdude »

_ache_ wrote: post #73
kzrdude wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you should say convicted instead of condemned. It's not really wrong, but condemned has many other connotations, which makes it less clear. It's not the first time he's convicted in court overall, but it's the first time for this charge.

Please, can you explains the difference between "convicted" and "condemned"? Convicted is about the fact of been a criminal and condemned about the fact that you have a condamnation/conviction/sentence?

Condemned has many other connotations which get in the way. "She condemned him" (she declared that he was reprehensible). "We condemn racism" (We really don't like racism). "Eternal condemnation" (Going to hell). And other meanings I'm sure that I'm not aware of.

Re: French ex-president Sarkozy begins jail sentence

#210

Post by ben_w »

someuser2345 wrote: post #201
greatgib wrote: post #146

Something really scary in France right now is that you can see really clearly how most mainstream media are used for propaganda. Since a few days, there is an abundance of cover and articles in most major newspaper here with propaganda and repeated lies supporting him. It's hard to imagine but non stop. You have everyday interviews of his family saying that it is an injustice, that he did nothing, that the judgement…

> Using a prepaid line opened with a fake name... Sorry, why is this such a big deal?

Committing a crime is bad, trying to cover up that you're committing a crime makes it obvious (as a generalisation) you knew you shouldn't have been doing the crime.
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