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Social anxiety isn't about being liked

chrislakin.blog

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Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#201

Post by immibis »

LorenPechtel wrote: post #199
ranger_danger wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since you brought it up, I will put in my 2 cents, and I will try to articulate it in a constructive way, not meant as an attack at all. Fair warning, I'm American and I realize you are European, and there are obvious cultural differences that may be at play. The main problem I have with you is the attitude. Very black-and-white thinking, as if you seemingly just know everything, about everything, which I don't think…

I have not noted his comment history so I'm only addressing this in a general fashion: A lot of things actually are black and white, but people invent shades in them in order to avoid having to admit there's a problem without a solution. I've been accused of black and white thinking many times, almost never has the accuser been able to actually show a nuance to the situation.

And other times, people invent shades in order to pretend there isn't a clear solution.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#202

Post by sublinear »

guluarte wrote: post #105

social anxiety i think it is more the fear of breaking your own perception of yourself

This is so true. All of the other comments and the article itself fail to take into account the ego.

At the end of the day you can only be sure that you are judging yourself. There's nothing else it could be about.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#203

Post by paulryanrogers »

cortesoft wrote: post #3

I hadn’t heard the word countersignaling before, but it matches something I had observed many years ago. My closest groups of friends always make so much fun of each other. We make negative comments about the worst traits about each other, the things that we are most self-conscious about… yet every time my friends make fun of me for something I worry about, I actually feel better and more comfortable with myself. Whe…

> My closest groups of friends always make so much fun of each other. We make negative comments about the worst traits about each other

That sounds terrible. A candid conversation about our flaws is one thing. IME 'friends' who most often mock each other are just trying to elevate their status in the group, by pushing others down.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#204

Post by tangotaylor »

abxyz wrote: post #47

The problem with using clinical phrases to describe normal behavior is demonstrated in this post. "Social anxiety" has a specific clinical meaning that is not covered by this post. The post is actually discussing a very natural and rational nervousness that normal people have in social situations. The post is providing a way of thinking about that nervousness that can help reduce it, for the nervous person's benefit,…

I completely agree and I don’t like when non-medical professionals take these terms too seriously.

Psychiatrists are way better equipped to diagnose these things not because they can read diagnostic manuals (anyone can) but because their training exposes them to real cases.

There’s a world of difference between feeling awkward and quiet at a social event vs having heart palpitations and panic attacks that prevent you from even going outside.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#205

Post by lioeters »

Trasmatta wrote: post #127
cortesoft wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have many friends who I don’t do this with, because I know they don’t like it and it doesn’t work with them. I show my friendship to them by understanding the type of person they are and knowing that friendly ribbing is not for them. Would you mind being friends with someone like me? Or do you feel like engaging in that behavior at all, even if not directed at you, is enough to make you not want to be friends with…

I would gladly be friends with someone like you!

Aww, that was sweet, the opposite of bullying or ribbing. I guess for some people it's too sweet for their taste/culture/personality, they're more used to the "mean kind of nice". I prefer the straight up kind of nice, like this, where I don't have to be on my feet for getting attacked. Writing this out, I see similarities with "play fighting" among cats or dogs.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#206

Post by refurb »

ants_everywhere wrote: post #56
abxyz wrote: post #47

The problem with using clinical phrases to describe normal behavior is demonstrated in this post. "Social anxiety" has a specific clinical meaning that is not covered by this post. The post is actually discussing a very natural and rational nervousness that normal people have in social situations. The post is providing a way of thinking about that nervousness that can help reduce it, for the nervous person's benefit,…

I agree with you as a general rule. But this is actually pretty close to how Social Anxiety is defined. It's about the fear of being negatively evaluated or embarrassed. For example the DSM definition https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK519712/table/ch3.t12/ or the Mayo Clinic explainer page https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/social-anxiet... . I think what this blog post is getting at is describing for…

> It's about the fear of being negatively evaluated or embarrassed.

It's not just a fear, it's "persistent and intense fear". and like most psychological disorders, a key part of the definition includes "a negative impact on the person's functioning in daily life".

Like OP said, fear of being embarrassed is entirely normal and healthy response. It's not social anxiety nor a psychiatric disoder.

It's not different than OCD, phobias, etc. They can all be entirely normal responses. What makes them a disorder is the level of intensity and the impact on the person's life.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#207

Post by refurb »

elevatortrim wrote: post #34

I have social anxiety and it is completely unrelated to likeableness. I do not think people would not like me, I do not try to avoid people disliking me, that's not the point at all. Quite the opposite, I'm sure I'm an interesting person and I'm confident people would like me if I could take the step. Problem is, there is something that physically prevents me from saying "Hi!" to a stranger. I literally cannot get my…

Like most anxiety disorders, there is a reason for your response. Your brain is basically trained to jump from stimulus -> response without cognitively thinking through stimulus -> interpretation -> response.

This is why cognitive behavior therapy can help many people. With a trained professional, you uncover the reasons why you developed the response. Once you know the thinking pattern that drives the response, you can work on changing those thinking patterns.

I've done CBT before and it's been quite helpful.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#208

Post by missingrib »

nexus2045 wrote: post #85
elevatortrim wrote: post #34

I have social anxiety and it is completely unrelated to likeableness. I do not think people would not like me, I do not try to avoid people disliking me, that's not the point at all. Quite the opposite, I'm sure I'm an interesting person and I'm confident people would like me if I could take the step. Problem is, there is something that physically prevents me from saying "Hi!" to a stranger. I literally cannot get my…

Mine is similar to this. In addition the anxiety comes from me thinking that most interactions are banal and more about “trading good vibes and energy” with the other person rather than a genuine deep conversation, and I fear that my facial expressions will reflect what I’m really feeling inside - “ugh can we transition off talking about my weekend or the weather?”. And also because I’m not that witty without alcohol…

This is relatable, mine is somewhat similar. It feels like a very specific version of performance anxiety that unfortunately affects the most banal social interactions. It is obviously multiplied tenfold when I'm in a situation where there are actual stakes (an interview, a first date, etc), but it still applies if I am just talking to a friend of a friend at a party that I don't know very well. The stakes feel very high to me because it's our first time talking.

It's less that I need them to like me or fear being disliked and more that I am just way too conscious of the stakes and the social interaction that's happening, which causes my brain to sort of freeze up. It feels like when I used to play tennis in high school. I'd do great at practice, then freeze up and barely remember how to hit the ball in games because the stakes on each point felt so high.

If I'm around some good friends it completely goes away. If I have hung around the person enough (even without directly talking to them), it goes away. I've also had random days where I don't feel the performance anxiety and performed really well in those situations (and coincidentally some of those days I'd meet a new group of friends or a girlfriend). It's extremely frustrating. Xanax makes the performance anxiety go away completely but slows me down cognitively so I become much less witty and interesting to talk to.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#209

Post by hilux »

rockercoaster wrote: post #37
cortesoft wrote: post #3

I hadn’t heard the word countersignaling before, but it matches something I had observed many years ago. My closest groups of friends always make so much fun of each other. We make negative comments about the worst traits about each other, the things that we are most self-conscious about… yet every time my friends make fun of me for something I worry about, I actually feel better and more comfortable with myself. Whe…

The book Impro treats extensively of what it calls "status games", in the context of building believable, natural scenes of dialog for the stage (or other dramatic purposes) and as a framework for making improvisation interesting. The author muses that the situation of feeling safe playing status games with another person—that is, treating them only as games, not as serious and with real status in play—is perhaps the…

OMG. The section (and one central page) in that book about status is one of the most insightful and meaningful things I have ever read in my entire life!

Once you recognize status transactions ... they are absolutely everywhere, in every single interaction.

Re: Social anxiety isn't about being liked

#210

Post by hilux »

cortesoft wrote: post #3

I hadn’t heard the word countersignaling before, but it matches something I had observed many years ago. My closest groups of friends always make so much fun of each other. We make negative comments about the worst traits about each other, the things that we are most self-conscious about… yet every time my friends make fun of me for something I worry about, I actually feel better and more comfortable with myself. Whe…

Yeah, I don't know about that. I had many people in my life (including close friends and relatives) who continued to be abusive "it's just fun teasing" even after I asked them to stop.

They are no longer in my life. I don't miss them even a little bit!

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