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DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

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Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#201

Post by uludag »

hnfong wrote: post #184
furyofantares wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah man, and it would be wild to publish an article titled "Ford Mustang and Honda Civic win gold in the 100 meter dash at the Olympics" if what happened was the companies drove their cars 100 meters and tweeted that they did it faster than the Olympians had run. Actually that's too generous, because the humans are given a time limit in ICPC, and there's no clear mapping to say how the LLM's compute should be limite…

All the while with skeptics snarkily commenting "Cars can move fast, but they can't really run like a human!"

... in opposition to the car makers who want to turn everything into highways and parking lots, who really want all forms of human walking to be replaced by automobiles.

"They really cant run like a human," they say, "a human can traverse a city in complete silence, needing minimal walking room. Left unchecked, the transitions to cars would ruin our city. So lets be prudent when it comes to adopting this technology."

"I'll have none of that. Cars move faster than humans so that means they're better. We should do everything in our power to transition to this obviously superior technology. I mean, a car beat a human at the 100m sprint so bipedal mobility is obviously obsolete," the car maker replied.

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#202

Post by ototot »

512 wrote: post #139
ototot wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because I'm a ICPC medalist (not this year though) but not a IOI medalist. Another evidence is that you only have 5 hours to solve 3 problems in IOI, but you need to solve 10+ problems in ICPC. It's impossible to have all 10+ problems to at IOI level in ICPC.

Are you an ICPC World Finals medalist? Because winning an IOI bronze medal is _way_ easier than even qualifying for the ICPC WF, and less than 10% of the teams at the WF get medals. I'd go as far as saying that gold at the IOI is probably easier than getting an ICPC medal. (One is individual and the other is in teams, but my point stands).

Yes. I'm a ICPC World Final medalist.

Totally agree that IOI bronze is way easier than ICPC bronze. In terms of rank/ratio, ICPC medals are more like IOI gold.

I stated things like that because I thought it's a bit easier to let people know the difficulty difference. (Agree weirdly though)

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#203

Post by bubblyworld »

paladin314159 wrote: post #64
amluto wrote: post #59

I've contemplated this a bit, and I think I have a bit of an unconventional take: First, this is really impressive. Second, with that out of the way, these models are not playing the same game as the human contestants, in at least two major regards. First, and quite obviously, they have massive amounts of compute power, which is kind of like giving a human team a week instead of five hours. But the models that are co…

> I think that, if you gave me the ability to search the pre-contest Internet and a week to prepare my submissions, I would be kind of embarrassed if I didn't get gold, and I'd find the contest to be rather less interesting than I would find the real thing. I don't know what your personal experience with competitive programming is, so your statement may be true for yourself, but I can confidently state that this is n…

Yeah, absolutely, I spent months preparing for the ICPC with my team and ended up scoring a paltry 3/12. A week would likely not have helped us at all - we simply had no idea how to approach the rest! Top teams are on another level.

Compute and such is a fair point but that AI is here at all is mind-blowing to me.

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#205

Post by Gud »

asboans wrote: post #104
amluto wrote: post #59

I've contemplated this a bit, and I think I have a bit of an unconventional take: First, this is really impressive. Second, with that out of the way, these models are not playing the same game as the human contestants, in at least two major regards. First, and quite obviously, they have massive amounts of compute power, which is kind of like giving a human team a week instead of five hours. But the models that are co…

Firstly, automobiles are really impressive. Second, with that out the way, these cars are not playing the same game as horses… first, and quite obviously they have massive amounts of horsepower, which is kind of like giving a team of horses… many more horses. But also cars have an absolutely massive fuel capacity. Petrol is such an efficient store of chemical energy compared to hay and cars can store gallons of it. I…

Your analogy is flawed.

Are the humans allowed to bring their laptops and use the internet? Or a downloaded copy?

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#206

Post by tosapple »

Davidzheng wrote: post #56
ferguess_k wrote: post #25

I think in the future information will be more walled -- because AI companies are not paying anyone for that piece of information, and I encourage everyone to put their knowledge on their own website, and for each page, put up a few urls that humans won't be able to find (but can still click if he knows where to find), but can be crawled by AI, which link to pages containing falsified information (such as, oh the inf…

I for one welcome advancement of science and mathematics from our AI overlords

And nuclear first strike capabilities.

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#207

Post by Ianjit »

NitpickLawyer wrote: post #2

So this year SotA models have gotten gold at IMO, IoI, ICPC and beat 9/10 humans in that atcoder thing that tested optimisation problems. Yet the most reposted headlines and rethoric is "wall this", "stangation that", "model regression", "winter", "bubble", doom etc.

Historically there has been a gap between the performance of AI in test environments vs the impact in the real world, and that makes people who have been through the cycle a few times cautious extrapolating.

In 2016 Geoffrey Hinton said vision models would put radiologists out of business within 5-10 years. 10 years on there is a shortage of Radiologists in the US and AI hasn't disrupted the industry.

The DARPA grand challenge for autonomous vehicles was won in 2006, 20 years on self driving cars still have limited deployment.

The real world is more complex than computer scientists apprecate.

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#208

Post by jaggs »

Davidzheng wrote: post #174
jaggs wrote: post #13

I think it's becoming clear that these mega AI corps are juggling with their models at inference time to produce unrealistically good results. By that it seems that they're just cranking up the compute beyond reasonable levels in order to gain PR points against each other. The fact is most ordinary mortals never get access to a fraction of that kind of power, which explains the commonly reported issues with AI models…

I think part of it depends on whether you see AI progress as research or product.

Very good point.

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#209

Post by thrwaway55 »

exclipy wrote: post #195
thrwaway55 wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the main difference is cars can't compress time in the way an array of computers can. I could win this competition with an infinitely parallel array of random characters typed by infinite monkeys on infinite typewriters instantly since one of them would be perfectly right given infinite submissions. When I make my tweet I would pick a single monkey cus I need infinite money to feed my infinite workforce and th…

In what way did the computer compress time? It completed it in 5 hours and I'm pretty sure they didn't invent a time machine

How long does a single thread take to do an attempt? How long do two threads take? I don't want to assume people reading this forum are children.

Re: DeepMind and OpenAI win gold at ICPC

#210

Post by jstanley »

raspasov wrote: post #191
levocardia wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Waymo cars are still being supervised by human drivers nearly 100% of the time That seems...highly implausible?

I mean that a human is ready to jump in at any point an "exception" happens. Example: During parking, which I witness daily in my building, it happens all the time. 1. Car gets stuck trying to park, blocking either the garage or a whole SF street 2. A human intervenes, either in person (most often) or seemingly remotely, to get the car unstuck.

I'm not in the US and have never seen a self-driving car.

Can you explain how a human intervenes in person?

Do you mean these cars have a human driver on board? Or the passenger drives? Or another car drops off a driver? Or your car park is such an annoying edge case that a driver hangs around there all the time just to help park the cars?

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