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“No tax on tips” is an industry plant

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Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#201

Post by xiphias2 »

voidUpdate wrote: post #165

What confuses me most is when you are given the option to give a tip before any service has been given. On deliveroo, for example, I have the option to tip the driver while I'm at the checkout. Why would I give a reward for good service when I have no idea if the service is even good? There's already a rider fee as part of my bill, so it doesn't make any sense to me to give them more money at that point

It might be a way for them to prioritize your order before others as they see how much money they earn, so actually it's a bidding process disguised as tipping. I'm not sure if it's shown in the backend though, but I have seen things like this in other delivery apps.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#202

Post by kelnos »

ecb_penguin wrote: post #84
bapak wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The crazier part is that it's spreading to more industries and more countries thanks to Americans thinking they should tip everyone everywhere. Thanks.

Yep. It's wonderful throwing a few extra bucks to some euro waiter and watching them treat you better than everyone else.

That feels disturbingly like a lite version of paying someone to be your friend. Maybe we should just all treat each other well (in both directions) and not reduce manners and social graces to a financial transaction.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#203

Post by bnralt »

ENGNR wrote: post #94
ecb_penguin wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bud, literally nobody gives a shit about waiting on you. They are literally only doing it for the money. People in Australia are still doing it for the money, even if you don't realize it.

Restaurant staff are still nice in Australia, and friendly. They don't HAVE to be, but they also don't have to do a bunch of unnecessary stuff to play the tips game, like fill up water that's barely empty or check in on how you're going all the time. Maybe people in America like a "service heavy" experience, and the only way to get it is tips?

> Maybe people in America like a "service heavy" experience, and the only way to get it is tips?

Interestingly enough, I find the service worse in the U.S. Part of the reason is that the tip system leads to waiters wasting time talking about a table, and waiters who aren't your own feeling like they don't have to do anything for you. It usually takes me 5-10 times longer to pay the check in the U.S. than it does in some other countries.

I wish restaurants started offering self service sections where you could order by phone and pick up the food yourself. Having to use waiters gives me the same feeling as when I drive through New Jersey and I'm not allowed to pump my own gas.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#204

Post by gambiting »

johnisgood wrote: post #181
gambiting wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Actually, let me be more accurate: people who pay with credit card always tip in cash, as there is no way to tip with a credit card. Eh? I don't know if you consider Poland eastern europe(I don't really), but I tip with a card all the time in Poland, you just ask "hey can I leave a tip on the card" and they bump up the amount by whatever you want to tip. And no, the amount doesn't then equal what's on the receipt -…

I tried tipping with card, and they told me that they can't "bump it up" (as in, they will get in trouble if they do). I suppose it depends on the place. I know for a fact that you can't tip with a credit card for parcel couriers. What I do not know for a fact is restaurants. So I suppose it varies. You tip doctors with cash, too. It is illegal to do so, but people do it and doctors expect it, it is just done more di…

>>What gave you the idea that I was referring to Poland?

I didn't have that idea, I'm just saying that in Poland I've never had any issues tipping with card and since you said "eastern europe" I wondered if you consider Poland eastern europe. That's all.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#205

Post by flanked-evergl »

oellegaard wrote: post #71

It’s crazy that this still happens in the US. Tipping is a thing of the past. Pay for your meal and have the restaurant pay their people for their work. End of story.

> Tipping is a thing of the past.

This statement is just not factual without some qualification. Where I live, and in the US in general, tipping is not a thing of the past. You can say you wish it was, you can say it should be, but what you said is not factual.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#206

Post by tallanvor »

hdgvhicv wrote: post #116
bigyabai wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I should have specified that I live in the east-coast United States. Tap-to-pay is almost as common as someone writing you a paper check or an IOU, out here.

Contactless is basically non existent in America? I know America has always been backwards (cheques were still in use well into the 21st century, card pins didn’t seem to catch on before contactless became a thing about a decade ago), but I thought contactless was quite high nowadays, especiallly with phones and watches. Certainly I’ve had no problem paying contactless in the cities I’ve been to recently - New York,…

Keep in mind that inertia is a thing. Businesses used to have to make an impression on your card on carbon copy paper and physically send the slips in to be processed. When they started swiping cards, restaurants would only have one terminal and it had to be connected to a phone line to work. Both of these situations made it common for you to hand your card to the waiter (usually in the book they brought the check) because they couldn't do it at the table.

Credit cards caught on later in other parts of the world, and they benefited from having more modern options with regards to the equipment used. Governments and banks also did more to mandate the use of security features (chip & pin) than in the US - American banks like people using credit cards - it makes them a lot of money and they're incentivized to keep the barriers low as long as the amount of fraud is manageable to them.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#207

Post by kelnos »

ecb_penguin wrote: post #81
oellegaard wrote: post #71

It’s crazy that this still happens in the US. Tipping is a thing of the past. Pay for your meal and have the restaurant pay their people for their work. End of story.

> Pay for your meal Not sure you know what tipping is, but it's not paying for the meal. It's paying for the service. 1. I like being able to pay for better service 2. Despite what people like to think, everywhere in the world has appreciated tips. I've never had a waiter refuse extra money. Literally dozens of countries, you get better service if you tip.

Not sure where you have (or haven't been), but I've been to several countries where I've tried to tip, and it's confused or even embarrassed the staff. They insisted I take my change. Granted, this was 15-20 years ago, and unfortunately tipping has become more pervasive, not less, so maybe if I were to revisit those places, things would be different.

But I do know this is still the case in Japan. Some Japanese service workers or small business owners will even be insulted if you try to tip.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#208

Post by flanked-evergl »

thuridas wrote: post #96

Aren't we creating incentives for workers abuse: - No tax on overtime: so now making them work 60 hours a week is cheaper for the employer - No tax on tips: so the tip based payment model is cheaper

Income tax is paid from employee salaries/wages, not by employers.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#209

Post by johnisgood »

gambiting wrote: post #204
johnisgood wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried tipping with card, and they told me that they can't "bump it up" (as in, they will get in trouble if they do). I suppose it depends on the place. I know for a fact that you can't tip with a credit card for parcel couriers. What I do not know for a fact is restaurants. So I suppose it varies. You tip doctors with cash, too. It is illegal to do so, but people do it and doctors expect it, it is just done more di…

>>What gave you the idea that I was referring to Poland? I didn't have that idea, I'm just saying that in Poland I've never had any issues tipping with card and since you said "eastern europe" I wondered if you consider Poland eastern europe. That's all.

Well, people consider Hungary to be in Eastern Europe, but it actually is in Central Europe, and so is Poland.

I use "Eastern Europe" when I am referring to Hungary only because people typically think that Hungary is in Eastern Europe. Perhaps I should stop doing that and just use "Central Europe", since it is them who are incorrectly believing it is in Eastern Europe.

Re: “No tax on tips” is an industry plant

#210

Post by kelnos »

quantummagic wrote: post #98
beAbU wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tip is usually given at the end of the service. How does that ensure a better experience during?

You're asking how a tip can influence a server, if they don't know it's coming. But in America they do know it's coming, at least, there is a cultural norm of tipping being expected. So it makes sense that a server would do what it takes, to make sure that it happens.

So in other words, you'd still get good service without tipping at all in places like the US. Granted, it might be awkward when it comes time to leave, and if they'd recognize you, you may not want to go back.
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