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After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

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Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#201

Post by concordDance »

jmward01 wrote: post #50

The obvious methodology at work here is 'fire everyone then hopefully re-hire only what is blindingly obviously needed'. There are many, many problems with this approach in a business setting but even more from a governmental setting. The first, and what should be obvious to anyone with an ounce of empathy, is that these are real people who's lives are being toyed with. It isn't like you are trying out a new business…

> It is about total benefit to society, period.

It's about benefit to society per cost. If you can fire someone over here and hire someone over there in a role that brings more benefit to society, that's good. Eg. Fire the telephone sanitizer hire the addict rehabilitator.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#202

Post by flir »

fastball wrote: post #191
flir wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Money is not the point of a government.

Yes, exactly. People who just want a stable job are in it for the (stable) money.

You just made an argument about government based on a comparison with the private sector, and now you're agreeing that government and the private secctor have fundamentally different goals. Got to admit, I'm a bit lost.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#203

Post by benterix »

fastball wrote: post #156
Terr_ wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, it's completely destroying an incredibly valuable asset: The reputation of being a stable long-term employer! (This is possibly their corrupt intent.) The immediate "savings" reduced workforce (even assuming the same level of work gets done) can easily be obliterated by the long-term damage of needing to pay more to attract equally-qualified applicants away from the private sector. Some quick napkin-math just t…

Do we actually want "I just want a stable job" people being a significant part of the federal governments workforce? I generally wouldn't want those people to work for my company, so not sure why I'd want them to work in my government.

Maybe a similar process occurred in Trump's head when he approved Musks cleansings. The weak point of this attitude is that those folks had a job with crappy pay but at least some stability, now they have none, so good luck finding people desperate enough to work for the government.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#204

Post by imgabe »

autoexec wrote: post #198
imgabe wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The first, and what should be obvious to anyone with an ounce of empathy, is that these are real people who's lives are being toyed with. It isn't like you are trying out a new business process. You are literally playing with entire lives here as if they are disposable things. This alone makes what is happening inhumane. This makes no sense. It is not a life, it is a job. The person isn't dead. They get a generous…

> This makes no sense. It is not a life, it is a job. The person isn't dead People's health insurance is tied to their job. Mass firings by the largest employer in the nation could easily result in several deaths as medical treatments are disrupted and medications missed, delayed, or changed with insurance companies. Not that death is required to screw up your life either. This is not a great time to be out of work.…

> People's health insurance is tied to their job. Mass firings by the largest employer in the nation could easily result in several deaths as medical treatments are disrupted and medications missed, delayed, or changed with insurance companies.

No, this could not "easily" happen. People get COBRA to continue their health coverage after losing their job. There is Medicaid and other programs for people who can't afford care. There are state exchanges where you can purchase insurance upon qualifying events like losing your job. There are a million and one ways to deal with this. Contrary to popular belief people in America do not immediately drop dead the second their health insurance lapses. This is nonsensical fear-mongering.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#205

Post by oneshtein »

makeitdouble wrote: post #117
lostlogin wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> an indictment of capitalism. Capitalism is the least bad system we have tried.

Who is "we" ? How many systems has "we" actually experienced first hand, and were the results such as you report them ?

"We" - humanity.

"We" actually experienced all social systems "we" invented so far, which are allowed by "our" productivity.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#207

Post by autoexec »

imgabe wrote: post #204
autoexec wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This makes no sense. It is not a life, it is a job. The person isn't dead People's health insurance is tied to their job. Mass firings by the largest employer in the nation could easily result in several deaths as medical treatments are disrupted and medications missed, delayed, or changed with insurance companies. Not that death is required to screw up your life either. This is not a great time to be out of work.…

> People's health insurance is tied to their job. Mass firings by the largest employer in the nation could easily result in several deaths as medical treatments are disrupted and medications missed, delayed, or changed with insurance companies. No, this could not "easily" happen. People get COBRA to continue their health coverage after losing their job. There is Medicaid and other programs for people who can't afford…

COBRA is a joke. It's way too expensive. Medicaid is on the chopping block, but even then it doesn't cover everything and not every doctor accepts Medicaid and "other programs". Tens if not hundreds of thousands of Americans die every year because they don't have insurance and can't afford the treatment they need.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#208

Post by hnlmorg »

fastball wrote: post #191
flir wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Money is not the point of a government.

Yes, exactly. People who just want a stable job are in it for the (stable) money.

99% of people who work are just in it for the money.

You’re a very blessed individual if you’re doing it for the love of the job rather than because you have to pay the bills and buy food.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#209

Post by oneshtein »

euroderf wrote: post #72
sollewitt wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A beloved Terry Pratchett character defines evil as when you treat people like things.

Well then, that's pretty much an indictment of capitalism.

Yep. Just look at countries with unbounded capitalism, like Russian Federation after fall of Soviet Union. It was a mess.

Developed countries installs thousands of regulations (100k - 2M regulatory acts per developed country) on top of wild capitalism to tame it.

However, even heavily regulated liberal capitalism is better than other systems.

Re: After 'coding error' triggers firings, top NIH scientists called back to work

#210

Post by hnlmorg »

kelnos wrote: post #151
Freedom2 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget to say "See! Government doesn't work, we've been right all along!" after you've smashed it.

Yes, this is the GOP playbook in a nutshell. 1. Rail against the idea that any social program can work, or that the government can do a good job administering it. 2. Fight for amendments to bills around it that reduce its funding or scope in key, critical ways. 3. Let the new thing fail, because you crippled the bill that authorized it. 4. Crow about how you were right all along, that government can't do this or that…

5. Then outsource that government work to private firms, preferably ones run by your friends and/or lobbyists, who are both more expensive and yet do a worse job too.
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