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The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

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Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#201

Post by crop_rotation »

nfw2 wrote: post #193
crop_rotation wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is dumb and the comments here are baffling. People are blaming Google for forks not being able to keep up. Like forks can be based on webkit or gecko if they don't like Google. Both Apple and MSFT are far far more closed in all their products where they have any inertia. Yet Google gets the flame mostly because of their incompetent PR and legal execution. Case in point Google got flamed here so much for dragonfly,…

Google lost a lot of goodwill on HN since the proposed web integrity api. HN has a strong aversion to perceived attacks on the open web. I personally don’t think it’s fair to single Google out and leave Apple and Microsoft alone. It may be overly cynical, but I think Google is in its current situation because it has fostered political enemies on both sides.

Google gets this treatment before any talk of web integrity API so no that was not it. I don't think this is necessarily about political enemies on both sides. Just that their PR is just so so bad. Like look at Brad Smith and all the big but empty statements he keeps making for Microsoft. Google needs someone like him.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#202

Post by Clubber »

loeg wrote: post #195
crote wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same way it worked in the past with monopolies like Ma Bell? Those teams can keep working on Chrome, they'll just have to fall under some new kind of separate Chrome Inc. structure instead of under Google Inc., and Google will have to sell most of its shares of Chrome Inc. to third parties. Splitting off Chrome really isn't the problem. Making the new Chrome Inc. profitable without accepting bribes from big tech, on…

Yes, that's sort of the problem. An independent Chrome probably wouldn't be profitable. This is essentially just forcing Google to fire the Chrome developers.

>This is essentially just forcing Google to fire the Chrome developers.

To be fair, Google could reassign them to something else. Firing everybody will be Google's decision that wasn't forced on them.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#203

Post by thrance »

loeg wrote: post #197
thrance wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does upholding monopolies help Americans at all? Do not conflate the ballooning wealth of billionaires with any kind of improvement in your material conditions.

Americans marginally benefit from American owned monopolies over Chinese owned monopolies.

How so? They pay almost no taxes, they capture a huge share of the market, they stifle innovation, they regularly engage in anti-user practices...

The bottom 90% is owning an ever smaller share of the economy, while the real economy doesn't seem to grow that much.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#204

Post by mrweasel »

nashashmi wrote: post #156

Keep Google Chrome. Separate search. Sell it to private equity. (I bet DoJ didn’t think about that whammy.) And start charging for everything else out there like maps, street view, and browser. And buy cloudflare while at it. Push themselves into everything related to connectivity and internet properties. The search business is the cash flow that is being a thorn in the side of Google. And it doesn’t even make sense…

You sort of make an interesting point. Google search isn't the main product, hasn't been for a decade. Still I don't think Google Ads would do amazing without the traffic from Google Search.

But it does solve an important problem: Who in their right mind would buy Chrome? It's not a profitable business to be in, without the surrounding ad business, and in turn the insane amount of traffic from Google Search.

Almost by definition, anyone who would be interested in buying Chrome and turning it into a commercial product shouldn't be allowed to buy it. The only buyer I can imaging is OpenText.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#205

Post by phkahler »

loeg wrote: post #195
crote wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same way it worked in the past with monopolies like Ma Bell? Those teams can keep working on Chrome, they'll just have to fall under some new kind of separate Chrome Inc. structure instead of under Google Inc., and Google will have to sell most of its shares of Chrome Inc. to third parties. Splitting off Chrome really isn't the problem. Making the new Chrome Inc. profitable without accepting bribes from big tech, on…

Yes, that's sort of the problem. An independent Chrome probably wouldn't be profitable. This is essentially just forcing Google to fire the Chrome developers.

Microsoft has a customized version of Chrome. Don't they already pay for it?

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#206

Post by dehrmann »

Who would even buy Chrome? No one's building new browsers, and MS even walked away from the browser game. Mozilla and Firefox haven't been relevant for a decade. The only buyer I can see is private equity, and that's sort of the big boy version of buying an abandoned browser plugin so it can track you and show more ads.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#207

Post by [deleted] »

dehrmann wrote: post #206

Who would even buy Chrome? No one's building new browsers, and MS even walked away from the browser game. Mozilla and Firefox haven't been relevant for a decade. The only buyer I can see is private equity, and that's sort of the big boy version of buying an abandoned browser plugin so it can track you and show more ads.

[deleted]

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#208

Post by DoctorOW »

phkahler wrote: post #205
loeg wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that's sort of the problem. An independent Chrome probably wouldn't be profitable. This is essentially just forcing Google to fire the Chrome developers.

Microsoft has a customized version of Chrome. Don't they already pay for it?

Yeah, I could imagine Microsoft making a bid. To people who don't follow tech product ownership, "Windows comes with Chrome instead of Edge" would be good PR and it could basically be Edge minus the rebranding.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#209

Post by Clubber »

asdfman123 wrote: post #163

At this point, tech's major competitors are overseas. Never thought I'd be making this argument, but does breaking up the search monopoly help America or up and comers?

>does breaking up the search monopoly help America or up and comers?

Big companies tend to calcify. We can see that in FAMANG's products. Big companies can also remove any direct competition in multiple ways that smaller companies can't:

  1. Bankrupt them through frivolous litigation.
  2. Buy them.
  3. Lower their prices so new competitors who don't have economies of scale can't be price competitive.
  4. Propose legislative regulation that they can afford but smaller competitors can't.
  5. Pay for negative news articles to be written against their competition (FUD).
  6. Poach their talent.
I'm sure there's more. Anyhow, monopoly status generally leads to stagnation not innovation.

Re: The DOJ still wants Google to sell off Chrome

#210

Post by MyOutfitIsVague »

fauigerzigerk wrote: post #109
CivBase wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of switching to Firefox is not "Google bad, Mozilla good". The point is to chip away at the chromium browser monopoly. If you have another non-chromium browser to recommend, please share as an alternative. Mozilla has not proven themselves to be trustworthy, but I think most would still consider them to be less untrustworthy than Google. Firefox offers similar levels of support, feature parity, and performa…

>feature parity No PWA support out of the box last time I looked. And Firefox (understandably but annoyingly) doesn't support some of the non-standardised Chrome APIs such as the File System Access API.

Not on desktop, but PWA support is there on Firefox for Android at least.
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