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5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

spectrum.ieee.org

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Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#201

Post by hocuspocus »

protocolture wrote: post #187
AkshayGenius wrote: post #69

Is there a reason we keep trying to use higher frequencies in every new wireless standard (Wi-Fi, 5G, now 6G) instead of trying to increase the maximum possible bitrate per second into lower frequencies? Have we already reached the physical limits of the amount of data the can be encoded at a particular frequency? Lower frequencies have the advantage of longer distances and permeating through obstructions better. I s…

5G's trick is MIMO. Basically just using more channel space for more data. In some places that means 3G/4G spectrum + 24GHz + 60GHz. And responding when you close a door and the 60GHz goes away. In some parts of the world where licensing worked out differently, it might just be a couple chunks of old 4G spectrum. Its not a monolith.

In most places it's 2G/3G/4G bands, either repurposed or through dynamic spectrum sharing, plus sub-6 bands.

mmWave is a flop.

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#202

Post by protocolture »

hocuspocus wrote: post #201
protocolture wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

5G's trick is MIMO. Basically just using more channel space for more data. In some places that means 3G/4G spectrum + 24GHz + 60GHz. And responding when you close a door and the 60GHz goes away. In some parts of the world where licensing worked out differently, it might just be a couple chunks of old 4G spectrum. Its not a monolith.

In most places it's 2G/3G/4G bands, either repurposed or through dynamic spectrum sharing, plus sub-6 bands. mmWave is a flop.

Its a flop in this circumstance for sure.

I used to have some early engineering material outlining what had been approved for use in each country and 24GHz was pretty damn common. Could be that changed I havent kept up.

I do know in Australia we have sweet FA and 5G isnt very interesting at all.

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#203

Post by trevithick »

viraptor wrote: post #147

> Could maximum data speeds—on mobile devices, at home, at work—be approaching “fast enough” for most people for most purposes? That seems to be the theme across all consumer electronics as well. For an average person mid phones are good enough, bargain bin laptops are good enough, almost any TV you can buy today is good enough. People may of course desire higher quality and specific segments will have higher needs,…

It won't be a problem for them. They'll find a way to make it not enough - disable functionality that people want or need and then charge a subscription fee to enable it. And more ads. Easy peasy.

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#204

Post by Gigachad »

viraptor wrote: post #147

> Could maximum data speeds—on mobile devices, at home, at work—be approaching “fast enough” for most people for most purposes? That seems to be the theme across all consumer electronics as well. For an average person mid phones are good enough, bargain bin laptops are good enough, almost any TV you can buy today is good enough. People may of course desire higher quality and specific segments will have higher needs,…

I think it's more that mobile transfer speeds is no longer the bottleneck. It's the platforms and services people are using. If you record a minute video on your phone it ends up as like 1GB. But when you send it on a messaging app it gets compressed down to 30MB. People would notice and appreciate higher quality video. But it's too expensive to host and transfer for the service.

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#205

Post by Gigachad »

hedora wrote: post #133
pr337h4m wrote: post #88

>Regulators may also have to consider whether fewer operators may be better for a country, with perhaps only a single underlying fixed and mobile network in many places—just as utilities for electricity, water, gas, and the like are often structured around single (or a limited set of) operators. There are no words to describe how stupid this is.

It actually works well in most places. Look up the term “common carrier”. The trick is that the entity that owns the wires has to provide/upgrade the network at cost, and anyone has the right to run a telco on top of the network. This creates competition for things like pricing plans, and financial incentives for the companies operating in the space to compete on their ability to build out / upgrade the network (or t…

Feels a lot like whitelabeling. Where you have 200 companies selling exactly the same product at slightly different price points but where there isn't really any difference in the product.

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#206

Post by squeaky-clean »

ai-christianson wrote: post #79
sidewndr46 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can pretty much guarantee you that your 5G connection has more bandwidth for upload than my residential ISP does

Yeah? We're getting 30-50 mbit/sec per connection on a good day.

I'm in NYC, Spectrum is my ISP. 500mb/s down, 10mb/s up. I used to live in a building with symmetric 1G fiber from Verizon, but they don't serve my building.

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#207

Post by kalleboo »

javier2 wrote: post #112
fny wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because competition drives innovation. 5G exists as widely as it does because carriers were driven to meet the standard and provide faster service to their customers. This article is essentially arguing innovation is dead in this space and there is no need for bandwidth-related improvements. At the same time, there is no 5G provider without a high-speed cap or throttling for hot spots. What would happen if enough peo…

Well, 5G is unlikely to be built in my area for the next decade, meanwhile 3 operators are building networks in the slightly more populated areas.

Coverage requirements could be part of the spectrum auction, like when Google managed to get "no SIM locking" part of the spectrum requirements for the 700 MHz band, opening up Verizon phones https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_United_States_wireless_sp...

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#208

Post by miki123211 »

I think what matters a lot more is the peak data rate per cell, not per device.

Once users stop demanding higher speeds, you can still get a lot more growth by giving them higher data caps or even unlimited plans.

This will make 5G home routers a very attractive option, particularly when the only other options you have available are cable and/or DSL.

I think wireless providers competing in the same playing field as traditional ISPs will turn out to be an extremely good thing for consumers.

Re: 5G networks meet consumer needs as mobile data growth slows

#210

Post by tomxor »

> for those with good 4G connectivity, 5G makes much less of an improvement on the mobile experience than advertisers like to claim

Complete BS. This misses the critical and common issue of user contention with 4G, which is the main relief 5G brings.

If all you do is compare peak throughput on paper you will miss the real world performance issues. In reality you will never see "good" 4G speeds, there just isn't enough bandwidth to go around in practice due to the lower frequency bands it operates in.

I've got both a 4G and 5G LTE router, both are Cat20 which means in theory can operate at up to 2 Gbit/s. Yet in practice, with any of the carriers in the UK the 4G modem will scape 40 Mbit/s at best in the wee hours, and drop as low as 3 Mbit/s at peak time. The 5G one will give me 600 Mbits all day long... because there is enough bandwidth to go around for all users, this is the key difference.

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