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10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

miamiherald.com

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Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#201

Post by gottorf »

labrador wrote: post #107

I support immigration and oppose the Republican anti-immigrant platform because it seems to me there is significant brain drain from many countries to the U.S. and that contributes to our success. For example, in this article is about white collar crime, it points out that many Somali-Americans were professionals back in Somalia. I'm not concerned about the crime because that seems like a somewhat higher tendency unt…

> I'm not concerned about the crime

You may not be concerned about the crime, but many voters are. The author of the article you linked to also exhorts the Somali immigrant community to not engage in crime.

> because that seems like a somewhat higher tendency until the 2nd and 3rd generation is able to make it into established society.

History and data from various European nations suggest that some immigrant groups aren't able to integrate with the host society after multiple generations, and remain ghettoized with low employment and high crime rates (vastly higher than the native population, for certain categories of crime).

It's clear that the national interest is in accepting skilled immigrants who migrate legally and are able to integrate fully into the host society, a la Teddy Roosevelt's dropping of the hyphen. It is not desirable to have separate ethnic groups who "share the same language, culture and faith" distinct from the mainstream.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#202

Post by abernard1 »

epolanski wrote: post #181
joecool1029 wrote: post #140

Again and again I've been arguing for access to information. Let Cuba land an underwater cable in Miami. Ever since I was young I was fed this line 'Glasnost helped accelerate the collapse of the Soviet Union, people wanted things their government wouldn't give them... free access to information not filtered by their government', but the US argues for some reason that Cubans can't have this. Is it fear of an even big…

Russians didn't give two shits about "free access to information", they cared to see that people in US lived richer lives that's it. Russians in Soviet union had to illegally trade and commit felonies to get their hands on some Italian mortadella. They had to go through insane lengths to buy a new tv. It wasn't glasnost but the oil crisis that ultimately killed the SU's economy and made people think that in democracy…

> In terms of gdp per capita Soviet russia was 33rd in the world in that year. Modern Russia is 52nd.

GDP was also calculated based upon prices in a free market. The problem being, if you don't have a free market, you don't have an efficient way of knowing if the "value" of the goods produced actually mattered. The Soviet Union massively overproduced goods that nobody wanted, as this was efficient for production. But in terms of quality of life, it didn't matter. Overabundances and shortages were the norm.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#203

Post by mixmastamyk »

torpfactory wrote: post #183
pton_xd wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Republican anti-immigrant platform because it seems to me there is significant brain drain from many countries to the U.S. and that contributes to our success. Explain how unskilled illegal immigrants contribute to our success. I'm open minded but I've yet to hear anything convincing. No one is opposed to the legal immigration of skilled workers.

There’s a very sizable number of low paying, dirty, dangerous, and/or boring jobs that we can’t find enough locals to do. Think farm hands, home care aides, meat processors, etc. Unskilled immigrants do those jobs because that’s what is available to them (I.e unskilled). If they weren’t doing those jobs, we’d have to pay significantly more for the goods and services that labor depends on. Immigrant labor is disinflat…

They're not all unskilled. Well-paying construction jobs, which used to be a path to the middle class, have been gutted (in the western US at least).

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#204

Post by ImJamal »

tuxoko wrote: post #188
zdragnar wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's really underselling the political persecution that many have suffered in Cuba. It's far and away from just wanting reparations for land grabs. We have sanctions on Cuba for the same reason we have sanctions on Russia and Venezuela now- we don't want to fund what their government is doing, and allying with them gives us little to nothing in return. That said, it's pretty obvious that economic sanctions…

> That said, it's pretty obvious that economic sanctions aren't bringing about regime change. On the flip side, you have China, where US pretty much helped build up their economy and hoped for a peaceful and democratic outcome. How well did that go?

The USSR and China and prime examples of sanctioning vs opening up. One is still around and persucting its people and the other is on the dust bin of history. The problem with the Cuba sanctions is that a large chunk of countries aren't sanctioning Cuba. If everybody got behind the sanctions regime change would happen. Half assing it won't cut it.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#205

Post by zozbot234 »

windowshopping wrote: post #192
pton_xd wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Republican anti-immigrant platform because it seems to me there is significant brain drain from many countries to the U.S. and that contributes to our success. Explain how unskilled illegal immigrants contribute to our success. I'm open minded but I've yet to hear anything convincing. No one is opposed to the legal immigration of skilled workers.

Why would we be opposed to unskilled immigrants? The majority of the people who came here from Europe in the 1700s and 1800s were laborers, factory workers, farmers, and other simple occupations. Why are we pulling up the ladder behind them? Did you want to freeze the US as it was circa 1950? Things change man. The US isn't forever, anymore than Rome was. You gotta stop trying to fight the current and pretending that…

> Did you want to freeze the US as it was circa 1950?

That's exactly what we're doing (in Europe and East Asia even more so than the U.S.) by opposing skilled migration. Increasing legal skilled migration is much more critical, though other concerns such as asylum rights for those fleeing from an oppressive government or a war-ravaged country also matter quite a bit.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#207

Post by WorkerBee28474 »

bawolff wrote: post #120
WorkerBee28474 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> illegitimate and illegal US embargo Illegitimate and illegal according to what authority? Unless you believe in God, there is no higher authority than the US government and its military might.

International law? That said, i don't think sanctions violate intl law. You are under no obligation to trade with people you dont like. A blockade probably would be (generally blockades are an act of war which is only allowed in defense or if un security council approves) however america isnt blockading it. Things can morally wrong without being illegal.

International law isn't real. You can tell it's not real because if it were real there would be real repercussions for violating it. There aren't, so it isn't. It's just words made up for politicking and persuasion.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#208

Post by mgbmtl »

spacebanana7 wrote: post #186
BurningFrog wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but a lot of people seem to think Cuba is cut off from world trade. They're only cut off from one country. Someone called it a "blockade" on this page.

Cuba’s ability to trade with the rest of the world severely impaired by the US embargo. Most international banks get very nervous about facilitating transactions involving Cuba and even tourists who visit Cuba can have their travel to the US restricted. https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/usa/entry-requireme...

Cuba rarely stamps passports to avoid those problems. They give you a piece of paper with a stamp, that you return on your way out.

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#209

Post by berdario »

BurningFrog wrote: post #179
wslh wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article exactly says "US embargo".

Sure, but a lot of people seem to think Cuba is cut off from world trade. They're only cut off from one country. Someone called it a "blockade" on this page.

At minute 12:33 in this video it explains the 180-days rule and other details:

https://youtu.be/WgWK6_AYq_o?si=5aqdt7DW-gYd7XdN

it might not be completely cut off, but the embargo is harsh, especially for an island ot only 10M people

Re: 10% of Cubans left Cuba between 2022 and 2023

#210

Post by jeffbee »

labrador wrote: post #107

I support immigration and oppose the Republican anti-immigrant platform because it seems to me there is significant brain drain from many countries to the U.S. and that contributes to our success. For example, in this article is about white collar crime, it points out that many Somali-Americans were professionals back in Somalia. I'm not concerned about the crime because that seems like a somewhat higher tendency unt…

Isn't that the opposite of what the stats tell us? Immigrants are the most law-abiding Americans, and their descendants converge to typical amounts of lawlessness in 1 or 2 generations.

https://www.nber.org/papers/w31440

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