Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators • Hacker News Board

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#201

Post by tptacek » Mon, Jan 22, 2024, 2:47 PM UTC

germinalphrase wrote: post #200

tptacek wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oak Park, IL is wealthy but not like Kennilworth wealthy, or Lincoln Park wealthy. OPRF, our public high school, has zero teachers making less than six figures. Lane III (bachelor's degree) CPS teacher entry comp --- year 1 --- is over $80k/yr, including benefits (a defined-benefit pension) and 10 weeks vacation.

The equivalent starting pay in my former district would by 37k/yr. I have relative living the Chicago suburbs that teaches. The difference in comp between her and I supports the numbers you have provided. I have also heard anecdotes about teachers that retired about 10 years ago and are provided 110+/yr on their pensions; however, the Illinois pension system seems to have crossed into "too big to fail" territory.

My mental model for this is that teacher comp in large urban and suburban school districts is quite good, and that comp in rural school districts is quite bad, and everything else is a crap shoot.

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#202

Post by rvba » Mon, Jan 22, 2024, 5:27 PM UTC

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #39

I am very close to obtaining an elementary school teaching degree (46 of 49 credits completed), and as of this year I am a full time teacher at a private school (which doesn't have to care whether I officially have a license). My masters program is considered among the best in the state. Unfortunately, I don't have many good things to say about my masters program. The majority of my classes have been interesting but…

Are those MBA questions? Because that would explain a lot!

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#203

Post by indymike » Tue, Jan 23, 2024, 1:23 PM UTC

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #39

I am very close to obtaining an elementary school teaching degree (46 of 49 credits completed), and as of this year I am a full time teacher at a private school (which doesn't have to care whether I officially have a license). My masters program is considered among the best in the state. Unfortunately, I don't have many good things to say about my masters program. The majority of my classes have been interesting but…

> We are not told any information about categories being weighted and therefore we cannot pay special attention to the low safety score."

And this is why we have debacles like the 737max.

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#204

Post by selimthegrim » Tue, Jan 23, 2024, 4:36 PM UTC

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #39

I am very close to obtaining an elementary school teaching degree (46 of 49 credits completed), and as of this year I am a full time teacher at a private school (which doesn't have to care whether I officially have a license). My masters program is considered among the best in the state. Unfortunately, I don't have many good things to say about my masters program. The majority of my classes have been interesting but…

There is such a thing as testing for the conjunction fallacy.

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#205

Post by Wowfunhappy » Wed, Jan 24, 2024, 2:25 AM UTC

selimthegrim wrote: post #204

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #39

I am very close to obtaining an elementary school teaching degree (46 of 49 credits completed), and as of this year I am a full time teacher at a private school (which doesn't have to care whether I officially have a license). My masters program is considered among the best in the state. Unfortunately, I don't have many good things to say about my masters program. The majority of my classes have been interesting but…

There is such a thing as testing for the conjunction fallacy.

Sorry, I'm not sure I follow. I know what the conjunction fallacy is but I don't see how it applies here.

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#206

Post by reducesuffering » Wed, Jan 24, 2024, 8:41 AM UTC

paulcole wrote: post #194

reducesuffering wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty fucking good, actually. That's why we're here writing copious amounts of text, more Bachelor's (a big general education) than average, reading articles, and upvoting ACX posts, someone who was top of the top in English class writing competency.

Agree to disagree, I guess. I’d give you a B- or so if you turned in your comment as an essay, given the easy-to-spot sloppy error and other issues. • Bachelor shouldn’t be capitalized unless it’s the full degree title like Bachelor of Arts • Copius writing doesn’t mean good writing • ACX should be explained the first time you use it

All that just to typo copious too, sheesh. 15 second long HN comments hardly reflect the writing strength of putting arguments to an essay. Or I guess IRC (Internet Relay Chat) folks are illiterate. So again, maybe you are the average ones if you think it's indicative of HN's success in their English/lit classes.

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#207

Post by selimthegrim » Wed, Jan 24, 2024, 10:50 AM UTC

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #205

selimthegrim wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is such a thing as testing for the conjunction fallacy.

Sorry, I'm not sure I follow. I know what the conjunction fallacy is but I don't see how it applies here.

Assuming a higher safety score means a “better” company isn’t an example (loosely speaking)?

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#208

Post by paulcole » Fri, Feb 02, 2024, 2:39 AM UTC

reducesuffering wrote: post #206

paulcole wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree to disagree, I guess. I’d give you a B- or so if you turned in your comment as an essay, given the easy-to-spot sloppy error and other issues. • Bachelor shouldn’t be capitalized unless it’s the full degree title like Bachelor of Arts • Copius writing doesn’t mean good writing • ACX should be explained the first time you use it

All that just to typo copious too, sheesh. 15 second long HN comments hardly reflect the writing strength of putting arguments to an essay. Or I guess IRC (Internet Relay Chat) folks are illiterate. So again, maybe you are the average ones if you think it's indicative of HN's success in their English/lit classes.

Yes! Of course I am average. Most people are average or worse.

And I did typo copius on purpose to get you to reply. Just a fun thing for me too do.

Re: Emergency-hired teachers without degrees as effective as licensed educators

#209

Post by ang_cire » Sun, Feb 04, 2024, 6:50 AM UTC

Corrado wrote: post #193

dan-robertson wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much approximately do you think a teacher gets paid? Obviously it depends on specifics so maybe say whether you’re imagining a city centre / suburban / rural school, and whether the state/district is wealthy and whether it’s a high school or whatever. I have some guesses in my head for something like ‘high school teacher in moderately wealthy Chicago suburb’ (I haven’t written the number here because I don’t want…

Almost my entire family are educators (wife, children, etc.) and we all agree that teacher pay is very low. Specifically, when you break it down at an hourly rate the pay is comically low. I think my wife calculated her pay several years ago at something like $2.00 / hour. Interestingly, during the height of the pandemic everyone seemed to come around to the fact that teachers didn't get paid enough for the amount of…

That rhetoric about teacher (and medical worker) pay during the pandemic was, whether people realize it or not, nothing but a cynical attempt to encourage teachers not to quit, in order to save the parents' jobs.

A lot of teachers (my wife being one as well) truly thought that people had been woken up to the incredible crisis in our education system, but 2-3 years later, we know better; they just wanted teachers to stay on long enough for their life situations to stabilize, so they could go back to ignoring them.