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Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

nytimes.com

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Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#201

Post by trotsky666 »

genewitch wrote: post #182
trotsky666 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We as in "Socialist Party of America"? I did not have a chance to contribute to this "discussion". What happens when this unbanking is practiced en-masse or when the US defaults on its foreign debt, with USD failing as the global reserve currency? The second one is imminent, and not only in my opinion.

That second one had better happen before 2030, because after that the US and one south american country being the only nations with net positive birth rates - and therefore populations that aren't aging out of productive work - coupled with the fact that it will take the rest of the world a couple of centuries to catch up to our military, means that the U.S. just needs to not be stupid for another 6 years or so. So r…

That net positive birth rate will mostly come from the part of the population that is hardly capable of modern competitive productive work. They will be increasingly appeased with hand-outs, in the form of basic income, welfare and especially of make-work, which will put further pressure on the US dollar.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#202

Post by dclowd9901 »

krupan wrote: post #70

The crazy thing to me in all this is that the types and amounts of transactions you make with your money and the bank is not criminal and never could be. It could however be a technique used to hide things that are criminal like fraud or theft. Somehow somewhere along the way we as a society decided we were ok with criminalizing the types of transactions that can be used to hide crime. That to me should have been a c…

Is there a legitimate, non-criminal reason to launder money?

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#203

Post by ClumsyPilot »

ensignavenger wrote: post #161
gnicholas wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What qualifies as an "extended amount of time overseas"? If you go on a vacation for 6-8 weeks, does that get you in trouble? I would think banks would want to keep big spenders who can afford months-long international travel.

Banks don't really have much choice in the matter. They have been deputized to enforce federal laws, and given penalties if they don't. To add a cherry on top, the laws are vague and require the bank to investigate, judge, and execute account closures. That being said, if you know when are are leaveing,.where you are going, and when you will be home, you can often put a vacation note on your account, and then the ban…

they are vague they catch every tom, dick and garry but so strict that every cartel still has acees to the banking system

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#204

Post by jryle70 »

csomar wrote: post #192
nanidin wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spent a year traveling in SE Asia circa 2012 and I didn’t have any problems with my bank account. n=1 and all that, and I didn’t have income coming from outside of the US, but I had countless ATM withdrawals and credit card spends. The only time a compliance officer has been in touch with me was when I was moving money to crypto exchanges.

2023 is very different to 2012. I remember back in the day you can open a paypal account with only an email and receive/send money with it. No kyc required.

I traveled to SEA extensively in 2022 and 2023. Never had any problems with using ATM to withdraw money. The only problem was with using Amex card.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#205

Post by krupan »

kmeisthax wrote: post #157
krupan wrote: post #70

The crazy thing to me in all this is that the types and amounts of transactions you make with your money and the bank is not criminal and never could be. It could however be a technique used to hide things that are criminal like fraud or theft. Somehow somewhere along the way we as a society decided we were ok with criminalizing the types of transactions that can be used to hide crime. That to me should have been a c…

The way you actually prosecute theft and fraud is by looking at the ledger of transactions to see what happened. Money laundering is any deliberate attempt to make tracing those transactions more difficult. Because it hides the evidence of theft or fraud, we criminalize it the same way we'd criminalize theft or fraud, because it's far easier to prove the cover-up than the actual crime. Furthermore, once you've shown…

"Money laundering is any deliberate attempt to make tracing those transactions [ones that prove you committed a crime] more difficult."

But that's not true. If it's not a deliberate attempt to hide fraud/theft but otherwise looks like actual money laundering, then it is still a crime, at least according to current KYC/AML laws. That's the real problem with this all. That's what makes the debanking problem (which you agree is bad) so easily ignored by law makers and law enforcement.

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#206

Post by redox99 »

kylehotchkiss wrote: post #78

Protip to anybody who wants to spend an extended amount of time overseas - you’re looking at a strong opportunity to join the list of people who have their accounts closed. Red flags include quantity of overseas debit card transactions, setting a PO Box (this one apparently is a very big red flag to banks) or a PMB as your bank address, lots of wire transfers. Open multiple bank accounts at different banks, use servi…

> Glad we have so much energy focusing on legit bankers instead of the crypto that is actually funding multiple US adversaries at this very moment

Funny you criticize crypto, when it actually solves all the bullshit you're mentioning.

It's so nice knowing for a fact that when I send or receive crypto, it will 100% arrive within moments, unlike the absolute shitfest that is international transfers (like SWIFT).

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#207

Post by ClumsyPilot »

MrVandemar wrote: post #179
constantly wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

edit

> on balance detrimental to society relatively recently Let's not forget Crypto mining has a not insignificant energy footprint, and is a driver of climate change. Really, detrimental to society from the get-go.

> Crypto mining has a not insignificant energy footprint

So do casinos and Las Vegas. Its basically the same thing

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#208

Post by pests »

zdragnar wrote: post #169
djangpy wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Staying overseas, I also got my account locked last month when I invoiced a consulting client. Seemingly out of nowhere because the previous 22 invoices cleared without an issue. But I am properly set up for this. We initiated a refund, and then I invoiced them through another EU business I set up just for this type of scenario. Then I issued a B2B invoice to my business in Europe, from my LLC in Asia; which then pai…

If you're still an American citizen, don't you technically still owe US to taxes on that "salary"? And since you're paying it as salary, I'm not sure that you're able to deduct any of the fees as expenses from what's owed.

The foreign tax credit is provided to prevent the double tax burden when your foreign source income is taxed by both the United States and the foreign country.

You just submit that you already paid taxes on that income to a foreign government and then no additional US taxes (to a limit, I beleive).

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#209

Post by TacticalCoder »

Ajay-p wrote: post #59
wolverine876 wrote: post #8

You can be barred from flying (is that still true?) and now banking, without trial or evidence. It's already highly anti-democratic, but imagine what an aggressive, oppressive government will do with this power.

You can also have your money and property seized without charge or conviction by police, while sitting on the side of the road. https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/05/the-gla...

I think there's a recent and ongoing bipartisan bill in the US trying to fix some of the worst aspect of civil asset forfeiture.

With some luck ten years from now there may be a bill in the US trying to fix some of the worst aspect of KYC/AML (like regular people getting their bank accounts closed for no reason and without any explanation).

Re: Why banks are suddenly closing down customer accounts

#210

Post by krick »

krupan wrote: post #70

The crazy thing to me in all this is that the types and amounts of transactions you make with your money and the bank is not criminal and never could be. It could however be a technique used to hide things that are criminal like fraud or theft. Somehow somewhere along the way we as a society decided we were ok with criminalizing the types of transactions that can be used to hide crime. That to me should have been a c…

> we as a society decided we were ok with criminalizing the types of transactions that can be used to hide crime

I'm not event sure that we, as a society, actually did decide that. When, how? Was there a vote, a referendum? I cannot speak for everyone, but to me it feels like we as a society sure as fuck didn't decide anything. Yes, somebody decided that, but we as a society never were a part of the conversation, really.

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