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Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

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201–210 of 362 posts

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that PE comes in and sets eight figures of their own money on fire and ruins a business, shooting themselves in the foot makes no sense, yet every other story online is about them doing exactly that. Of course there are LBO scams going on (more historically rather than currently) but these billion dollar firms don't come in and lose a ton of their own money along with money of their outside investors on a re…

They come in, reduce costs as much as possible, keep revenue coming in as long as they can while having huge dividends to said PE until they get so far into debt they are not sustainable. They'll swap to service providers that they either own or get a cut from and pay themselves. Then their purchased company gets bankrupted, sells their assets to cover their debts (including said PE's 'debts' of services provided.) T…

Who’s the one offering them the debt in the first place? You’d think if it were so easy people would wise up to it and stop offering debt to PE owned firms.

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#202
post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A doctor knows what his practice is worth and wants every cent he can get out of it - but the next generation of doctor is not going to be able to compete with debt financing what a PE cash-buyer can get. In my opinion, the physician in this example is a monster. Profit maximization is a choice, not some kind of moral imperative. Am I supposed to have any respect for somebody selling out their employees and patient…

Well, keep in mind that from the perspective of the rest of the healthcare industry, private practices are kind of dinosaurs at this point. They don't play well in our modern system, and the last 50 years of healthcare legislation has done everything short of outright banning them. New doctors are not trained or expected to run businesses. Getting money from medicare or insurance is a nightmare. Patients want access…

This explains quite a lot about why health care has been noticeably getting worse over the last several years -- for everybody.

In my part of the US, you can't even find a doctor that is taking new patients at all, private practice or otherwise. Talking with some doctors, it's clear that being a doctor these days is a very undesirable job. I know I wouldn't want to do it.

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#203

I have a pet theory: there are managerially-minded university graduates who value prestige more than power or pay. In the post-War era, they became beige-suited company men. In my generation, they went corporate finance. Today, they work for private equity. Banking was great. Everyone–from liberal arts to engineering majors–could putz around for years in a pre-defined and prestigious path with moderately above-market…

The banality of evil.

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#204
post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No retiring physician is owed anything for the “value” of their practice. Not saying you are wrong, but this makes private practice different than any other small business. Pretty universally most businesses are evaluated by their capex. (If the medical industry is unique it's because there is no business to evaluate without a practitioner) But 100% to everything else you said. Private practices are clearly superio…

I think they meant more that you don't get some magic pass for years of service, kind of thing. If you have built up a paying customer base, odds are high that you can leverage that to another owner, no? No need for PE to get involved. Unless you are trying to maximize every penny you can get on that sale alone.

It’s more complicated than that.

TL;DR: To a larger degree than most businesses, the physician is the value in a medical practice.

Let’s say you’re a dermatologist in Lincoln, Nebraska. You want to live there because of family reasons or whatever. You build a great thriving practice. You’re clearing $1m in profit annually.

(A high, but doable number for a dermatologist with a good private practice)

Now it’s time to retire.

First of all, you can’t sell a patient. Patients go where they want to. You also can’t sell medical records. Because laws. Nor really would you want to.

All you can do is sell patient habits, and tangible assets.

But of course the biggest asset is the physician themselves. And they don’t come with the practice when they retire.

Now sure. There are ways of driving non-directly-physician-derived lines of revenue in a practice. Maybe you have a nurse that does aesthetics. Maybe you sell skin creams or whatever. But generally, those lines of revenue are still broadly dependent on the physician.

So what you need is a physician who wants to move to Lincoln, Nebraska at the same time you want to retire, and buy your practice.

But even if another dermatologist did want to practice in Lincoln at the right time, why should they pay a bunch of money to you for your practice? They could just start up next door.

Sure, they’d have to buy some equipment and hire and train staff, but there’s a good chance they’d have to do some of that even buying your practice.

And truth be told, they know you’re retiring anyway, so why not just wait it out?

Plus, medical specialists are in short supply. Especially those who want to move to Lincoln at that very moment. (I’m being hard on Lincoln. I went there once and it was nice. I just don’t imagine it’s a destination most highly qualified medical specialists dream of moving to.)

So probably the actual value of your practice is “the number that makes it less of a hassle to buy you out than for another specialist to start up their own practice.” Assuming there is a specialist who wants to move to where you’re selling.

And remember, if such a person already exists, they already own the most valuable asset of your practice: a qualified medical specialist.

So in a traditional medical practice sale scenario, your valuation almost certainly isn’t going to be a multiple of your revenue or profit like a more traditional business.

And the location can be a real challenge too. I know classmates of my spouse who turned down salary offers in the $800k range in the rural Midwest (with the potential to earn much more in the future through partnership/ownership) in order to make less than half that in the cities they wanted to live in.

Even if your practice is in a desirable location, most of these issues still apply. It’s just much more likely you’ll find someone to buy your practice for some value and not have to shut it down and sell it for parts.

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#205
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that PE comes in and sets eight figures of their own money on fire and ruins a business, shooting themselves in the foot makes no sense, yet every other story online is about them doing exactly that. Of course there are LBO scams going on (more historically rather than currently) but these billion dollar firms don't come in and lose a ton of their own money along with money of their outside investors on a re…

To be fair, I think there are also some PE firms that simply aren't that good at their job.

Yeah, I buy that. Especially in the age of ZIRP.

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#206

Instant Pot just got knifed by PE. https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/12/23758602/instant-pot-bank... > The other reason it’s absolutely got to keep growing is that there are expectations placed upon it by Cornell Capital, the private equity firm that acquired the Instant from its founder in 2019 and merged it with Corelle Brands, which makes all the Pyrex and CorningWare products you probably heat up leftovers in. … >…

By knifed you mean the corporation that owns it is going through chapter 11. Debt will be converted to equity, and the shareholders will be wiped out.

Instant Pots aren't going anywhere.

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#207
post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Better than doing the same work with heavier patients in nursing homes for $12/hr.

The level of mental trauma endured by vets I doubt is matched by elderly care nurses.

It definitely is, source - my sister managed an elderly care facility during the pandemic

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#208

I am curious if there is a database of all the companies that are being run by a PE firm to bring transparency around the track record of PE firms.

In an analysis of "European companies around their buyout event in the period 2000 - 2008," private equity was found to "select companies which are less financially distressed than comparable companies prior to the transaction and that the distress risks increase after the buyout" [1]. Critically, however, "the distress risk in private equity-backed companies does not exceed the distress risk in comparable companies three years after the buyout," and, "despite this risk increase, private equity-backed companies do not suffer from higher bankruptcy rates than the control group."

More broadly, an analysis of "17,171 worldwide leveraged buyout transactions that include every transaction with a financial sponsor in the CapitalIQ database announced between 1/1/1970 and 6/30/2007" found bankruptcy rates around 6% [2]. This isn't exceptionally high.

[1] https://madoc.bib.uni-mannheim.de/31366/1/dp11076.pdf

[2] https://pubs.aeaweb.org/doi/pdfplus

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#209
post #169

A friend of mine is a Vet at a place recently sold to a PE firm. If your wait times are crazy long, if you can't get through on a phone, if you realize your vet's office has parted ways with the great vet you used to see -- that's the PE firm counting beans and destroying the service for customers in an effort to squeeze every dollar out of the system. As a specific obviously bad example -- Vet services in California…

Why wouldn't your friend just open up a practice and compete with this dysfunctional company?

Money. It takes hundreds of thousands to do so, you gotta borrow that. Then it takes 10 or 20 years to pay that back. Then to get your retirement paid for you sell it to a private equity company.

Re: Private equity is buying everything from vet offices to tech conglomerates

#210

A friend of mine is a Vet at a place recently sold to a PE firm. If your wait times are crazy long, if you can't get through on a phone, if you realize your vet's office has parted ways with the great vet you used to see -- that's the PE firm counting beans and destroying the service for customers in an effort to squeeze every dollar out of the system. As a specific obviously bad example -- Vet services in California…

That sounds bad for the customer, but how does that play out for the owners? Does this sort of behavior end up working out better for them financially? If so, despite how bad it sounds, it does seem like they end up with more efficient economics (assuming it's sustainable). If not, then surely the PE firms will suffer too right?
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