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Is 40 hours a week too much?

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Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#201
post #69
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard Elon does 120 hours a week. /s I haven't seen anyone doing 40 hours a week. At least not more than a week.

Medical residents work 80 hours a week. And that's an average over 4 weeks, so they could work 90 easily one week. 40 is nothing...

With patients paying a staggering toll as a result.

Maybe we should work pilots like that... It'd certainly make flying more "fun"

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If you are actually doing 40 hours a week you are productive as hell." That's assuming that the work you've been set to do is productive, and you're doing it in a productive manner. For instance, I've spent weeks grinding away on features that never get used by customers. Is that productive? I've also spent hours trying to fix a bug because of infrastructure/platform/tooling constraints that means the code/compile/d…

Only weeks? Jesus. I feel like I've spent a good decade or two of my best years doing that. "No better options" is a hell of a drug, haha.

Well, sure, the total amount of time I've spent working on features that never ended up getting used by customers over the last two decades or so is something I wouldn't want to think about. A certain amount of it is inevitable with software development (or probably any sort of product design and development), and you'd like to think you're at least learning something from the experience, but undoubtedly you could be doing better things with your time...

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#203
No, but I think it should be 40 hrs including transit, and overhead time; yes I would even include walking around, if it's a large facility. For whatever reason I have to walk pretty far for drinks and bathrooms... so it counts.

It goes with out saying that there's some flexibility for appointments and personal matters. You don't have work extra hours after going to your doctor for cancer (extreme example there are smaller).

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#204

I've always felt a bit like an alien from outer space when trying to understand the work habits of modern humans. It seems we spend enough time doing what we think we have to do to survive that it feels like the only thing we actually do. Everything else in our life feels secondary. I'm not sure this is even normal in nature. Seems like a lot of animals spend much of their time just sort of hanging out. Does it hones…

I believe a lot of people understand this but they have no choice, especially those working for less money.

IMO the bigger problem is consumerism and the ephemeral nature of many goods (they break easily). This keeps us on the hamster wheel forever.

If it wasn't for that, my current salary can cover _everything_ in my rented flat for one year of work, maximum two. Add 5-10 more for a good flat or a house.

It seems the system doesn't want people to retire at 30. So we're kept busy and all our stuff breaks constantly.

It sucks and it gave me a serious existential dread but I see no way out. Working hard to maybe have a side gig with a passive income is the best I can do right now.

So again, I believe a lot of people understand what you're saying but what can they do?

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#205
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard Elon does 120 hours a week. /s I haven't seen anyone doing 40 hours a week. At least not more than a week.

I've seen tons of people doing it for extended periods of time. I can think of - ambitious people working in competitive environments (research, corporations, students) - doctors/dentists/nurses, lot of them work long hours and their job require focus - small business owners

And as long as their patients are willing to pay the costs of this practice with their blood, everything will be fine :)

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#206
40 hours is just a handy figure, like eight hours is a third of a day, third you spend on sleeping, third you spend on life, third you spend on work. I believe it was established due to these equal ratios. We kinda all work in manufacturing still, just the goods we manufacture have changed, yet we still spend about equal part of our life on it, probably due to strong tradition. Some are seeing 20 hour "void" in their third, cause really they want to spend 20 more hours on something else.

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> while it's actually somewhere between 10 and 20, with the rest being a big void. are you joking? 2 hours a day is nothing. > actually doing 40 hours a week you are productive as hell. i've easily topped 100 hours a week for prolonged periods. i'd guess it is the same for any founder.

Yeah, I think there is a pretty big culture bubble, and know people on both sides. Some people spend most of their life working 60 real hours weeks, especially blue collar work. I have a white collar workplace, and there is a big spread. There are people that do 20 hours of real work and those with a 60+ hour average. I have done 100+ hour weeks of real heads down work & all nighters , but can't/wont do it prolonged.…

I have never experienced long hours translating into raises or promotions. Then again, I have worked for startups.

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#209

I've always felt a bit like an alien from outer space when trying to understand the work habits of modern humans. It seems we spend enough time doing what we think we have to do to survive that it feels like the only thing we actually do. Everything else in our life feels secondary. I'm not sure this is even normal in nature. Seems like a lot of animals spend much of their time just sort of hanging out. Does it hones…

I believe a lot of people understand this but they have no choice, especially those working for less money. IMO the bigger problem is consumerism and the ephemeral nature of many goods (they break easily). This keeps us on the hamster wheel forever. If it wasn't for that, my current salary can cover _everything_ in my rented flat for one year of work, maximum two. Add 5-10 more for a good flat or a house. It seems th…

Yep, agreed. Didn't mean to blame people necessarily.

Re: Is 40 hours a week too much?

#210
In my stupidity, I've never understood when the 40h, or any X hour per week for that matter, became a requirement per law, instead of an upper limit for health safety.

For example, some different type of roads have different upper speed LIMIT. They also have a minimum required speed. Nobody is forced to drive at the upper limit constantly.

Today is not a good day, I'm having hard time putting my thoughts into words.

Moreover, I think it would be good to shift from hourly salary to daily salary. Whether you work 1h or 50hr in a particular day, it shouldn't matter, you should be paid for the day. We never say my hourly living cost when we talk about living expense, instead we say daily living cost. Which is a better metric in my opinion. One day of work should at least guarentee one day of living cost. This should be a LAW, that every employment (indipendently of hours) should guarentee per LAW the living expenses for a day. It might be hard for some kind of jobs, I understand. But I think we can do better than getting paid hourly.

I live with my parents, so I can save some money. Honeslty, I just need $30 to eat 2 healthy meals and $15 for rent a day. How much hours is that for a Software Engineer, 1-2hrs of work with a lot of extra money. Why should I slave away the rest 6-7hrs? This also helps with my creativity, because I cannot pre-allocate and command my brain to be creative for the allotted time, excatly from 9am to 5pm.

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