Why does it have to look like a Macbook?
Because as much as some of us want unique computers, they just don’t sell as well as MacBook clones.
Unfortunately.. I miss the days where manufacturers were more willing to be bold.
99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
201–210 of 245 posts
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#202Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#203Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's also a searing indictment of Linux. I get less than half the battery life on my Alienware AMD laptop under Linux than under Windows. I don't know what Linux is doing wrong here, but it is not energy efficient.
There's a lot of Linux apologists in your replies but my experience is exactly the same _with a laptop that supports Linux_ (Framework laptop). I'm running a very recent kernel in Fedora and have tried numerous power saving mechanisms (currently autocpufreq, although it's results are not much different from gnome PPD) and I'm lucky if I get 3 hours from the thing while running 10-15 FF tabs and a single instance of V…
My experience is exactly the opposite.
If that make me a "Linux apologist" I don't really care.
Install TLP, uninstall thermald, and make sure turbo mode is off (it's on by default in Linux - probably applies to Intel only).
Under light load the system is using 6-8w (about 9-10h of usage on the 80WH battery), under 4w when completely idle. This is latest Fedora on a ThinkPad X1 Extreme with KDE. I want to see that with Windows.
You have to invest a bit more time with Linux (for example the fingerprint reader on my Laptop prevented the CPU from going into lower power modes), and that part is unfortunate.
On the other hand I never experience things randomly not working like it was with Windows.
Your mileage may vary.
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#204Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's a lot of Linux apologists in your replies but my experience is exactly the same _with a laptop that supports Linux_ (Framework laptop). I'm running a very recent kernel in Fedora and have tried numerous power saving mechanisms (currently autocpufreq, although it's results are not much different from gnome PPD) and I'm lucky if I get 3 hours from the thing while running 10-15 FF tabs and a single instance of V…
My experience is exactly the opposite. If that make me a "Linux apologist" I don't really care. Install TLP, uninstall thermald, and make sure turbo mode is off (it's on by default in Linux - probably applies to Intel only). Under light load the system is using 6-8w (about 9-10h of usage on the 80WH battery), under 4w when completely idle. This is latest Fedora on a ThinkPad X1 Extreme with KDE. I want to see that wi…
>Install TLP, uninstall thermald, and make sure turbo mode is off (it's on by default in Linux - probably applies to Intel only).
Sorry, but that's not a good argument in favor of Linux when basic power management is not part of the OS and you need to set it up yourself manually. Can you imagine Microsoft or Apple shipping their OSs without power management? I need an OS to work out of the box so I can get to work/entertainment, not a hobby to tinker with. I still enjoy tinkering with Linux but it should be only when I want-to, not a need-to.
> I want to see that with Windows.
Yeah, you can get Linux to be more economical than Windows by manually installing a bunch of tools that throttle down the CPU into its lowest power mode and running it at 600MHz fixed all the time, and now you have a laptop that's super slow, all for the sake of battery life and winning online arguments. Good job. /s You can force that in Windows as well, but why would you?
I want to see Linux automatically scale the CPU power and frequency based on the load put on it like Windows does: idles at 600MHz when doing nothing, click on the Firefox tab and it shoots up to 3,6GHz, then back down to 800MHz. That's what any sane OS should do out of the box, not have you install and fiddle with a bunch of tools and maybe still not be as good.
>On the other hand I never experience things randomly not working like it was with Windows.
I have way more things randomly not working on Ubuntu 22.04 Gnome at work than on Windows 11 at home (none actually on this one).
And I'm saying this an Linux/FOSS user and fan.
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#205Earlier quoted context omitted.
The thing is, there aren't really that many laptops designed to run Linux. Even offerings like these and those from System76 are actually made largely based on designs made to run Windows and adapted later. Sure, this feels like a cop-out and is not really of much aid to anybody, but it's only fair to note. Generally, I do not have dramatically worse battery life on Linux vs Windows, but I also did stop buying laptop…
> Even offerings like these and those from System76 are actually made largely based on designs made to run Windows and adapted later. System76 does get complete hardware specs from the chipset manufacturer, though, and their cooperation in porting an open-source firmware to the motherboard. They run Coreboot instead of the proprietary OEM UEFIs, and this has let them achieve some nice things in power management (incl…
I haven't owned a System76 laptop personally, but I really like what they have done in theory. I've actually been waiting largely because I'm interested to see what they put out when they start fabbing their own laptops.
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#206Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's also a searing indictment of Linux. I get less than half the battery life on my Alienware AMD laptop under Linux than under Windows. I don't know what Linux is doing wrong here, but it is not energy efficient.
There's a lot of Linux apologists in your replies but my experience is exactly the same _with a laptop that supports Linux_ (Framework laptop). I'm running a very recent kernel in Fedora and have tried numerous power saving mechanisms (currently autocpufreq, although it's results are not much different from gnome PPD) and I'm lucky if I get 3 hours from the thing while running 10-15 FF tabs and a single instance of V…
Framework laptop doesn't have option to buy with Linux, there is only an option to buy without Windows. For me that is not what officall support is.
I had Motile M141 laptop with Ryzen 3200U and it had better battery life on Linux than Windows.
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#207Earlier quoted context omitted.
100% this. I'm using a Windows notebook at work, and I cannot go for a single week without running into some random window management bug. Despite it being the origin of its name, Windows is actually really bad at windows stuff. And that's before we get into intentionally missing features like focus-on-hover.
Can you explain more about the focus on hover feature being intentionally missing? I’ve never heard of this.
I'm not sure about whether it's supported on Windows (and why if it's not), but I think it refers to having whichever window the cursor is over being "active" by default. For example, if you have two windows open that both have a text input focused (like maybe a text editor and a browser), the more common window-management paradigm is to consider one of them "active" independent of the cursor. If the text editor is active, you need to "switch" to the browser to type into it (by clicking on it, alt-tabbing, closing the editor, etc.). An alternative way of doing things would be to have the text you type go into whichever window the cursor is over. I haven't tried out using this, but I do find this behavior noticeable when playing a game on one monitor and having a web browser open on the other. Often if something is loading, I'll switch over to the browser to read hacker news or something while waiting, but then when the game is finished loading and I switch over, I'll try to move or something and be momentarily baffled at the lack of movement until I realize that I just typed "w" or something into the browser.
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#208Earlier quoted context omitted.
There's a lot of Linux apologists in your replies but my experience is exactly the same _with a laptop that supports Linux_ (Framework laptop). I'm running a very recent kernel in Fedora and have tried numerous power saving mechanisms (currently autocpufreq, although it's results are not much different from gnome PPD) and I'm lucky if I get 3 hours from the thing while running 10-15 FF tabs and a single instance of V…
I'm very disappointed in my Framework/PopOS! Ships with Linux, some good marketing. I think PopOS! has lost the thread on why they exist, in that it started as an 'it just works' version of linux, and it seems to be managed as yet another enthusiast grade linux. It doesn't take much time over at r/popos to see this sentiment spelled out. I'm not leaving the linux ecosystem, but I can tell you i'd be shocked if I go w…
I don't see option to order Framework laptop with PopOS!
If you install OS yourself, it is not officially supported.
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#209Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree with everything you said except for the window manager comment. i3/sway puts MacOS and Windows to shame. I could get used to my work macbook if only it would let me move focus in more than one dimension (i.e. super+left/right/up/down instead of cmd+tab back in time). MacOS is especially bad because they don't even try to address their deficiencies. They just bandaid over it with an app ecosystem and then don'…
100% this. I'm using a Windows notebook at work, and I cannot go for a single week without running into some random window management bug. Despite it being the origin of its name, Windows is actually really bad at windows stuff. And that's before we get into intentionally missing features like focus-on-hover.
> I'm using a Windows notebook at work, and I cannot go for a single week without running into some random window management bug
Could you please share some details on all these Windows GUI bugs?
Re: 99Wh Battery Linux Laptop
#210Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not convinced Framework actually supports Linux, though. AFAICT, it supports Windows and can ship with no OS, and you have to do the rest yourself. To predictable end (e.g. having to deal with kernel parameters to make it work.) The firmware involved is also distinctly non-trivial.
That's actually one of the big reasons I've held off on buying one (although the #1 reason is lack of AMD options), and am eyeing laptops from HP and Lenovo that actually advertise full Linux support (like the HP Dev One). Even if those laptops don't support Linux as well as they claim to, it seems like it'd be less of a headache to deal with than Framework with their unique dongle situation.
HP Dev One hits all checkboxes except it has very glossy screen.