Earlier quoted context omitted.
I tried to get such a kitchen scale and couldn't find one that wasn't either highly imprecise or ridiculously expensive (like three digit euros) If you have a vintage one that is reasonably exact, they're great.
You cooking meth there or something? It's a kitchen scale, I doubt you'd need that much of precision from it.
Everything with a battery should have an off switch
201–210 of 613 posts
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#202(Background: I work in product design/new product development, and conceivably might have designed this thing! If any of those were still designed in the Western world. Which they aren't. I have designed some stuff like it, though!) Oh, great, this debate again! I shall use this post as ammunition next time I am arguing with our stupid design team about why we need an off switch on the stupid product we are designing…
Does that come from clients?
I used the same 3-in-1 latch circuit for power on/off, pairing, and software power off for 12 years.
A good enhancement mode NMOS FET can be as good as a physical switch at low voltages.
If you really need nano-amp level leakage current AND very low drop, you can consider turning to beefy depletion mode devices, which gate the user will discharge with the button press. A nice benefit is that you can directly sense the button press with an MCU.
I once even did a bluetooth mouse with this "hardware" switch, and a graceful shutdown: we sense voltage on the buck capacitor, and detect when the battery disconnect triggers.
The few microfarads in the capacitor are enough to send the last update with the 0% battery level, and a disconnect command.
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#203Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#204Earlier quoted context omitted.
Get Vernier calipers! The scale is easy to learn and use and measurements will be at least as precise as electronic calipers. With no batteries required the tool has much less of an environmental impact and you never need to worry about whether the calipers will work or not.
There are also calipers with a dial. https://www.otelo.fr/waroot/images/products/600/40130350_A.g...
Usually you can pay the vendor to calibrate the tool for a couple bucks more.
of course digital ones are much, much easier to read, but you only really feel that convenience when having to measure hundreds of items quickly to sort them into a tray or something...
And in the end, usually a Nonius type caliper is good enough anyways, and skilled users can read those to up to 0.02mm... and thats already pretty good and most of the time: good enough
and in case you do need to know the length of something down to a micron, there are other tools for that with less sources for measuring errors
so yeah: mechanical calipers rock and: you dont have to always get the brand things to get what you need
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#205>> (Our design team will never listen. This is because they, one, don't listen to anyone ever; and two, never use the products they design. Oh, sure, there might be a user study or two. But they never actually have to live with or work with the damn things.) This is so obvious from everyday life that someone really ought to write a paper about it and have it published in Nature. Because it will certainly be published…
I get that you're pissed, but there's plenty of technology that you seemingly forget about (being pissed off makes you a bit irrational) that works most of the time. Saying nothing ever fucking works is just a dumb take
When it’s failing is when it comes to the forefront. Crappy touchscreens seem to be a major component in lots of them, had an experience with an elevator “system” with a touchscreen that was mildly annoying.
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#206Earlier quoted context omitted.
> This is because they, one, don't listen to anyone ever; and two, never use the products they design. Oh, sure, there might be a user study or two. But they never actually have to live with or work with the damn things. I wonder the percentage of consumer (and business - have you ever used a POS in a pub?!) electronics this applies to? It's gotta be high 90s. I've lost track of the number of times I've lamented "did…
> I've lost track of the number of times I've lamented "did anyone actually use this?" We have a combination oven and microwave (yes...) that seems to have been designed with the primary purpose of enraging the owner. The microwave can only be set in 15 second increments. But you can fine-tune it, in five-second increments, by spinning a dial. Except that you can't do that while the oven is on. The microwave makes a…
When we moved into our current house, it had a microwave like that. When we replaced it, my primary requirements were 1. multiple fan speeds, and 2. a nice, simple touch pad for entering the time; preferably one where you didn't need to press a button before starting to enter the cooking time.
The dial thing is... infuriating. It never once found a situation where it made using the device better, and in most situations it made it worse.
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#207The trouble with a mechanical off switch is that you cannot easily / periodically turn it on, so it depends on your usecase. AVR Picopower has been around for about 10y now. These devices dramatically drop power consumption to the point where batteries should last a very long time, definitely >1y, more like 3-5y. The fact that modern devices drain a lot of juice is either sloppy SW design or sloppy HW design, since I…
Just lookup circuits.
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#208Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I've lost track of the number of times I've lamented "did anyone actually use this?" We have a combination oven and microwave (yes...) that seems to have been designed with the primary purpose of enraging the owner. The microwave can only be set in 15 second increments. But you can fine-tune it, in five-second increments, by spinning a dial. Except that you can't do that while the oven is on. The microwave makes a…
That must be frustrating, but was quite funny to read. I would happily invest in kitchen appliances that have a silent mode for apartments and shared living spaces. My microwave beeps at the end, and then beeps again 10 minutes later once the food has been removed. My old toaster beeped 5 times when the toast popped, which is unnecessary when the popping action is loud on it's own.
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#209Another hot take: every device where Bluetooth isn't the sole method of interacting with the device (think AirPods), you should be able to turn off Bluetooth. You haven't seen hell before you've seen a speaker with Bluetooth that you can't turn off and you can't stop your neighbours from accessing. Or more specifically, heard hell.
Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch
#210>> (Our design team will never listen. This is because they, one, don't listen to anyone ever; and two, never use the products they design. Oh, sure, there might be a user study or two. But they never actually have to live with or work with the damn things.) This is so obvious from everyday life that someone really ought to write a paper about it and have it published in Nature. Because it will certainly be published…
It's a book actually: The Design of Everyday Things
The reasons it's the worst design guidance out there is that it teaches: 1) that engineers should NOT be entrusted/involved with user design. 2) to conceptualize users as blissful idiots. 3) that obscuring errors in a system is actually a good thing.
All of these are things that I see the lasting effects of in products I use in every day. Don't get me wrong, I bought this with the best of intentions. It was the highest rated design book on Amazon on the topic. Reading through was an extremely painful exercise in essentially coming to realize that everything I see broken in the engineering teams I work with and products I use is actually codified in words.
Take this excerpt as an example -- p. 65: "Eliminate all error messages from electronic and computer systems. Instead, provide help and insight."
Are you f'ing kidding me? You cannot seriously think this is right. For the longest of time I wondered why I hated using Apple products. It turns out Norman was schooled at Apple and they absolutely practice this teaching. I bought an early-day iPod touch circa 2007 and proceeded on to loading all my music on it. A few upgrades later, some albums disappeared without any error. I searched and searched and searched, trying to describe my problem in a number of different ways on Google to see what I could find. And all I could find were semi-answers. But you know what? If it had actually displayed "error 0xFHJAD1234" when failing during the upgrade, I could've actually google that. And I'll spare you the story of what I had to do when the family Mac's HDD failed ...
So this is what we actually get, devices that SILENTLY fail, designed for people who are assumed not to know what they're doing and who likely do NOT have any technically-literate person around them that could assist them if they could in fact identify the problem.
Worse, this philosophy probably hints at a level of intellectual ignorance/arrogance that is quite fascinating. You see, in my line of work I have to be able to walk engineers I work with from the gate-level silicon all the way up to cloud and AI. Without any false modesty, I think I have a fairly good idea of how modern computer architecture works. Yet, I will be the first to tell you that I have no idea how any of these systems work in full. In fact, no one does. Not the best of kernel developers nor the best of chip designers. To claim that you can somehow inventory every possible problem in a computerized system and then provide a graceful exit from that or useful info is either ignorant or arrogant or both. But since you've eliminated engineers from the design loop (see #1 above), no one will tell you you're full of it.
So yeah, no. Do read Norman's book. But look at it as everything you should NOT be doing.