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Death by PowerPoint: the slide that killed seven people (2019)

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Re: Death by PowerPoint: the slide that killed seven people (2019)

#201
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably correct, and I have doubts that those types of problems are easily fixed because they're rooted in human psychology. It's interesting to me that the "big" incidents seem to occur every 15-20 years, almost as if there is a new professional cohort who has to learn the hard way. I do think clear communication is a necessary, but insufficient, element of fixing that problem.

This could also be related to a broader tendency to promote 'performers' who are more likely to take risks or shortcuts that they might not realize involve risks as well as people that use less resources (lower safety margins, less overlapping checks etc). It's sadly difficult to be recognized for excellence in preventing surprises, as hard as it is to quantify that.

I think this is absolutely part of the issue. Having previously worked in the industry, people who bring up concerns are sometimes viewed as pariahs who are slowing down work. Because so many of the concerns involve low-probability events, it's possible for someone to make a career rolling the dice without being cognizant of (or open about) the risks. When bad things do happen (thankfully, major catastrophes are still relatively rare), it's hard for people to openly recognize the mitigations that could have prevented it because they think instituting them on future projects will just slow things down. It creates a culture of "the ends justify the means" where bad judgement and integrity violations are considered ok as long as the project/program was completed.

Re: Death by PowerPoint: the slide that killed seven people (2019)

#202

The article doesn't do the slides nor the evidence justice. It might be more illustrative to study the original article by Edward Tufte, which the writer (and I) learned about the issue from, https://www.edwardtufte.com/bboard/images/0001yB-2238.gif https://www.edwardtufte.com/bboard/images/0001yB-2239.gif I think it's why I think teaching engineers how to draw and do good design is important. How big is a cubic inch…

> The article doesn't do the slides nor the evidence justice.

That's an understatement. A close reading reveals that it misrepresents the position of Tufte's writing, the conclusions of the investigation board, and the report of the subsequent return-to-flight group.

And it uses "sweetened" (fabricated) figures, to boot. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30622688>

Re: Death by PowerPoint: the slide that killed seven people (2019)

#203
post #200
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's not a high school presentation done for the sake of doing a presentation. It's not an audience who will review the performance. It's giving information to _professional_ _experts_ who are _responsible_ for consuming that information.

>it's not a high school presentation I agree, we can expect more from the presenters here. Experts are humans, experts get bored, experts can't necessarily follow your bad presentation. Underneath it all we're smart monkeys, not robots. You can't force yourself to pay attention indefinitely. It's not in our biology. No matter how smart you are if you hear hours of presentations in a day, you will only take home a cer…

Experts are human but it is their responsibility to not get bored in an important presentation regardless of the presenter. That responsibility means the fault is assigned to them and not the presenter.

I agree with your last paragraph but after any bad event you could point at the presenter and say "I didn't consume the information they were providing - therefore blame them not me"

Re: Death by PowerPoint: the slide that killed seven people (2019)

#204
post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>it's not a high school presentation I agree, we can expect more from the presenters here. Experts are humans, experts get bored, experts can't necessarily follow your bad presentation. Underneath it all we're smart monkeys, not robots. You can't force yourself to pay attention indefinitely. It's not in our biology. No matter how smart you are if you hear hours of presentations in a day, you will only take home a cer…

Experts are human but it is their responsibility to not get bored in an important presentation regardless of the presenter. That responsibility means the fault is assigned to them and not the presenter. I agree with your last paragraph but after any bad event you could point at the presenter and say "I didn't consume the information they were providing - therefore blame them not me"

I would still maintain that only because you're an expert you don't have superhuman abilities of controlling your attention/boredom.

You say we can't absolve the experts from responsibility here, but it appears you want to absolve the presenters of any kind of responsibility.

Why do these experts need superhuman focus abilities while the presenters needn't even have the presentation skills of 8th graders?

But in the end we should maybe change the format of conveying information completely, whoever is to blame here.

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