FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine • Hacker News Board

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#201

Post by thehappypm » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:44 PM UTC

nanis wrote: post #37

DSingularity wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if it you compare that to a mortality rate of 1.7%? All of a sudden .001 % death rate seems pretty good. What do I know though — this isn’t my area.

Where exactly do you get the 1.7%? Is it computed the same way the breakthrough deaths are computed? What is the denominator in each case? I see, you are using this table[1] ... This is the case fatality rate (which is inflated depending on how many infections are never recorded). Using the numbers provided by the CDC, if we put the cases in the denominator and not the vaccinated population, we have: Hospitalized or…

In my home state, Massachusetts, .3% of the total population has died of Covid-19. If you make a safe assumption that not 100% of people have been infected you can make a very basic assumption that the infection fatality rate is around .5-2%.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#202

Post by evan_ » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:44 PM UTC

sharken wrote: post #154

version_five wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. No doubt this will be the case for some. So, you've found a logical flaw in people's stated reasons for not wanting a vaccine. How does that help anything? In these kinds of debates, the actual goals or beliefs of both sides often differ from what they say. For example, the government being able…

These cheap shots or trench war between both sides does nobody any good, it divides people instead of unite them. For me the major issue with the vaccine is the extremely fast track from inventing it to getting it out the door. An FDA approval will not change my mind on the safety of the vaccine, only time can do that. By that i mean that we need more time to assess the long-term effects, something that many pro-vacc…

> we need more time to assess the long-term effects

You seem to be saying that the only issue is a question of time. Be specific: how much time? Will you say a specific number? “I will accept an mRNA-based vaccine if it has been around, and proven safe, for x years.”

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#203

Post by flowerlad » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:44 PM UTC

thehappypm wrote: post #151

tohnjitor wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FDA approval is mostly meaningless. Just this year they approved an Alzheimer's treatment which ended clinical trials early because it didn't work. https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2021/06/08/th...

I think you're over-simplifying the Alzheimer's treatment. The medicine was shown to be effective in reducing plaques, and has been approved for any medical use where reducing plaques is the goal. However, reducing plaques does not seem to actually help patients with Alzheimer's. So the medicine "works" in the sense that it does what it's supposed to (reduce plaques) but does not help Alzheimer's patient outcomes and…

> However, reducing plaques does not seem to actually help patients with Alzheimer's

Just like reducing cholesterol does not lower heart attacks.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#204

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:44 PM UTC

sharken wrote: post #154

version_five wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. No doubt this will be the case for some. So, you've found a logical flaw in people's stated reasons for not wanting a vaccine. How does that help anything? In these kinds of debates, the actual goals or beliefs of both sides often differ from what they say. For example, the government being able…

These cheap shots or trench war between both sides does nobody any good, it divides people instead of unite them. For me the major issue with the vaccine is the extremely fast track from inventing it to getting it out the door. An FDA approval will not change my mind on the safety of the vaccine, only time can do that. By that i mean that we need more time to assess the long-term effects, something that many pro-vacc…

[deleted]

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#205

Post by peakaboo » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:44 PM UTC

nojito wrote: post #178

sharken wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These cheap shots or trench war between both sides does nobody any good, it divides people instead of unite them. For me the major issue with the vaccine is the extremely fast track from inventing it to getting it out the door. An FDA approval will not change my mind on the safety of the vaccine, only time can do that. By that i mean that we need more time to assess the long-term effects, something that many pro-vacc…

>By that i mean that we need more time to assess the long-term effects, something that many pro-vaccine people seem unwilling to accept. That is unfortunate. We are way past the time frame for long-term effects to manifest themselves for a corona-like vaccine.

This is not true. There could be birth defects or lower iq in babies born from vaccinated mothers.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#206

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:44 PM UTC

antattack wrote: post #158

peakaboo wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if true, so what? It's their bodies. They should be allowed to choose, just like you are.

"Even if true, so what? It's their bodies. They should be allowed to choose, just like you are." Is this still true if unvaccinated takes a hospital bed away from someone else or increases insurance costs to everyone else due to more expensive care?

[deleted]

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#207

Post by endisneigh » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:45 PM UTC

miked85 wrote: post #193

endisneigh wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not really what your link says tho. > Both vaccines were highly effective during this study period against SARS-CoV-2 infection (mRNA-1273: 86%, 95%CI: 81-90.6%; BNT162b2: 76%, 95%CI: 69-81%) and COVID-19 associated hospitalization (mRNA-1273: 91.6%, 95% CI: 81-97%; BNT162b2: 85%, 95% CI: 73-93%). However, in July, the effectiveness against infection was considerably lower for mRNA-1273 (76%, 95% CI: 58-87%) w…

You literally posted the part describing how much effectiveness has dropped with variants.

Two doses of Moderna is still highly effective. What are you going to do? Stay unvaccinated?

Given that both Pfizer and Moderna have virtually no side effects why wouldn’t you get it at these efficacy rates, even if lower?

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#208

Post by zamalek » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:45 PM UTC

cbg0 wrote: post #13

cmpb wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also possible that its approval will result in more people getting the vaccine due to those people now having an out from their initial reaction that it was rushed (but still sticking to their convictions up to now in order to avoid embarrassment).

More likely than not, they'll just move the goalposts farther and find a different excuse for not getting it.

We're having a vaccinated wedding. Unvaccinated/uninvited guests are now employing the base rate fallacy: "there are more breakthroughs than unvaccinated cases."

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#209

Post by xyzzyz » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:45 PM UTC

antattack wrote: post #158

peakaboo wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if true, so what? It's their bodies. They should be allowed to choose, just like you are.

"Even if true, so what? It's their bodies. They should be allowed to choose, just like you are." Is this still true if unvaccinated takes a hospital bed away from someone else or increases insurance costs to everyone else due to more expensive care?

Replacing “unvaccinated” with “obese” here gives an argument for forcing obese people on diet against their will.

Re: FDA Approves First Covid-19 Vaccine

#210

Post by auslegung » Mon, Aug 23, 2021, 2:45 PM UTC

ldehaan wrote: post #185

acdha wrote: post #6

I’m wondering what the odds are that people will pivot from “it’s experimental” to “it was rushed due to politics/greed”. I think a huge factor will be how many employers, colleges, etc. are now willing and legally able to require vaccination. It’s one thing to say you trust something you read on Facebook more than your doctor and quite another to walk away from a job because of it.

It'll be so easy to walk away from a company if they tried to force me to do Anything. But i make tons of money off all this fearmongering, it's great. I can't wait until you have to take a 4th shot, money all the way to the bank. I caught covid for a day, still showing the strongest markers, i never noticed it, all I did was take vitamins and exercise, good friend got the vaccine, still can't walk, sick as a dog.

> I caught covid for a day, still showing the strongest markers, i never noticed it, all I did was take vitamins and exercise, good friend got the vaccine, still can't walk, sick as a dog.

Your anecdotal evidence of 2 people sure is convincing! Everyone should do what you're doing.