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Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

reuters.com

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Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#201

Post by nosianu »

jb775 wrote: post #114
_Microft wrote: post #6

The interesting table with absolute numbers is on page 18 of [0]. Expected and observed cases are cases of myocarditis / pericarditis here. Crude rate is the number of cases per 1 million administered doses. Use landscape mode if you are reading this from a mobile device, the table is narrow enough for that. Age group Doses Crude Expected Observed administ. rate cases cases 12–15 yrs 134,041 22.4 0–1 2 16–17 yrs 2,25…

But this is only reported cases. Most people wouldn't report even if they had symptoms. Others could be impacted without currently having symptoms. Now prop this data of actual medical conditions created as a result of getting the covid vaccine up against the likelihood of getting covid in the first place, and the likelihood of having lifelong side effects as a result of getting covid. Risk of getting an experimental…

Not sure why teh parent post got downvoted - we have plenty of examples right here in the various sub threads of people telling us exactly that. Almost none of all those who wrote a comment with their own anecdote seem to have reported it, many only realizing that there even is anything worth reporting after reading this discussion right here.

For most people it is perfectly normal not to report anything unless it's bad enough that they have to see a doctor. Most people already expect some side effects for a few days since we've been told to expect it, for anyone following the media.

A statement about under-reporting is not automatically "anti-vax".

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#202

Post by sjg007 »

EMM_386 wrote: post #183
Mountain_Skies wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wonder if this will lead to an increase in pericarditis over the next couple of years. I had pericarditis when I was a teen. The explanation from the cardiologist, which probably was dumbed down for me, was that sometimes a foreign body like bacteria or a virus gets hidden in the lining of the heart and when it later gets exposed to the immune system, it causes the pericardium to get enflamed, which squeezes the hear…

> How long do spike proteins (SARS-CoV-2 or vaccine created) hang out if they make it to the heart? As far as I understand it, the vaccine doesn't work like this. It tells your immune system "hey this is what a SARS-CoV-2 spike protein looks like, attack it if you see it". So the vaccine wouldn't cause the heart damage, the vaccine does (intentionally) ramp up your immune system to learn about this new threat, which…

The covid spike protein binds ace2 so the immune response to bind the spike could bind ace2 as well. Normally this is mitigated by a self selection filter but it is not out of the question that you could develop an autoimmune response.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#203

Post by JPKab »

Fomite wrote: post #179
JPKab wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a relatively high rate (fully acknowledged) of high fever from the MRNA vaccines, particularly after the second dose. Compared to standard vaccines of the past, the rate of fever and illness is dramatically higher. But COVID is so dangerous and contagious that the benefit is higher than the cost. I say this as somebody (if you look at some of my previous comments) who lost my Mother-in-law due to a rare side…

Note it depends on which "standardized vaccines of the past" you mean. The side effects for the smallpox vaccine were horrific by modern standards.

Excellent point. And I would have innoculated every single one of my kids in a heartbeat, knowing the risks, because smallpox is such a vicious disease.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#204

Post by loa_in_ »

EMM_386 wrote: post #183
Mountain_Skies wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wonder if this will lead to an increase in pericarditis over the next couple of years. I had pericarditis when I was a teen. The explanation from the cardiologist, which probably was dumbed down for me, was that sometimes a foreign body like bacteria or a virus gets hidden in the lining of the heart and when it later gets exposed to the immune system, it causes the pericardium to get enflamed, which squeezes the hear…

> How long do spike proteins (SARS-CoV-2 or vaccine created) hang out if they make it to the heart? As far as I understand it, the vaccine doesn't work like this. It tells your immune system "hey this is what a SARS-CoV-2 spike protein looks like, attack it if you see it". So the vaccine wouldn't cause the heart damage, the vaccine does (intentionally) ramp up your immune system to learn about this new threat, which…

There are two variants of the vaccine:

One is mRNA (?) variant that gets into your cells and makes them produce just the spike protein. This lets your immune system find this protein out and make antibodies.

The other contains instead a partially destroyed viruses which trains the immune system directly on all their parts - the shell, the spikes, etc.

I don't remember which company makes which kind but both are in production.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#205

Post by Klonoar »

Giorgi wrote: post #68

Damn it, I already have heart problems and still in queue for mRNA thinking it was safer than AstraZeneca clots risk. Guess not. Crap.

FWIW, I also have a heart condition, and experienced no issues.

Obviously I can't give you medical advice, but figure it's worth noting that it's not a guaranteed experience. ;P

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#206

Post by moron4hire »

oogabooga123 wrote: post #199
throwaway5752 wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would "take your chances" (quotes because it's both rare and temporary according to the linked article) with the vaccine rather than risk infection with covid: https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-hidden-long-term-cog...

Very interesting! But I would rather just get infected. To each their own, I’m sure we can agree!

Natural infection won't provide as long lasting of immunity compared to the mRNA vaccines. And if the vaccine is going to inflame your heart, I seriously doubt it's going to be anything but far worse from the natural infection.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#207

Post by arriu »

version_five wrote: post #195
arriu wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's up with the down votes... It is a legitimate question. People get heart inflammation from things like court visits. If you know something then please share.

I didn't vote on your post, but I did read it earlier and found it a bit silly. "White coat" syndrome- getting nervous going to the doctor or for medical things, is definitely real. I have it too. I always have a hard time getting my blood pressure checked because I get so involuntarily aggravated by the whole thing. And there are definitely people afraid of needles. But (nearly) everyone has various vaccinations dur…

I don't think it's enough to say people get vaccinated and we didn't see this in the past. This is quite different. Many people are afraid of this vaccine more than others in the past. I've had countless arguments with family trying to convince them it's okay. Their arguments are A) it's mRNA, which is new... And B) they argue it was rushed.

I can't help but think about how someone with that mental state would feel while in the waiting room.

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#208

Post by T-A »

motohagiography wrote: post #136
lame-robot-hoax wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but the route in which a vaccination takes place (IM injection into deltoid) should mean that much much less of the spike protein ends up in the heart and lungs vs a natural infection. As well, the overall amount of spike protein in the body will be less. https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2021/05/04/sp... “Consider what happens when you’re infected by the actual coronavirus. We know now that the hug…

Does that imply that the difference in hitting a vein with the injection vs. staying intramuscular would be where in the body the protein travels to and causes an immune response? Nothing is ever that simple, but of cases with effects consistent with the protein being in the blood stream with consequences to the heart and brain, if that were a factor, it would be both testable and avoidable, and provide the explanati…

It's been hypothesized that AstraZeneca's vaccine is more likely to cause clots when accidentally injected intravenously:

https://www.sortiraparis.com/news/coronavirus/articles/24662...

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#209

Post by andai »

moron4hire wrote: post #206
oogabooga123 wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very interesting! But I would rather just get infected. To each their own, I’m sure we can agree!

Natural infection won't provide as long lasting of immunity compared to the mRNA vaccines. And if the vaccine is going to inflame your heart, I seriously doubt it's going to be anything but far worse from the natural infection.

Can someone explain why this the mRNA vaccine (which tells your body to produce spike protein and thus mimic the virus) produces long-lasting immunity but the actual virus which is being mimicked does not do that?

Re: Heart inflammation cases in young men higher than expected after mRNA vaccines

#210

Post by robbiep »

jlokier wrote: post #131
makomk wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The trouble is that the people apparently at risk from this are not the people at risk from Covid-19. The risk to people between the ages of 12 and 24 from Covid is really, really small. Especially towards the lower end of that age range, most countries seem to be seeing low single-digit per million deaths: https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4...

The risk of death from Covid-19 is low in that age range. But what about the risk of heart inflammation from Covid-19 in that age group, possibly with no other Covid symptoms?

That’s the right question to ask
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