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“User engagement” is code for “addiction”

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Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unrelated to original thread - I find it interesting the way you approach this comment. You mention pricing almost as if you're apologizing. Your competitors, even if they are binge-focused, don't apologize for charging customers. They would never have a an advert that says "we've got this great course, but before you go check it out, I'll warn you, it costs money". I like your thinking of non-binge learning, and thi…

I appreciate it. We've struggled with communicating the non-binge aspect, and usually approach it from the other side: by talking about reviews, spaced repetition, remembering, etc. But I think you're right that approaching it from the "non-binge" side is a good idea. Coincidentally, we're about to do a major landing page revision, so the timing is right to give that a try! As for apologizing for charging money... yo…

I'd look at it from another perspective. Committing to learning an entirely new language is a big undertaking, so ideally you want to make sure that the resources you're using are of high quality. In that sense, it costing money is actually a good thing, since it signals that this is premium quality content and worth spending your time on. Of course this needs to be clearly communicated as such, like Brilliant.org for example (at least their marketing communication focuses on the quality).

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Baker Crack-dealer is a spectrum. But wherever you are on the spectrum, you always draw the line one step to the right.

It's not, though - that's the point. You're either a baker or you're a crack dealer - you don't get to be a baker that just sells a little crack, that's not how it works.

Isn't sugar a suitable substitute for crack?

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#203
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a family-run bakery near my house that specializes in cheesecakes. They make the best cheesecakes I've ever tasted. They only make a certain number (~200, say, I dunno really) per day, they always sell out, then they close for the day. Every year they take a two-month vacation. That's it. That's the whole business. Anthony Mangieri was downtown for a few years here in SF before he went back East. https://www.…

> sell out, then they close for the day. Every year they take a two-month vacation. What is stopping their landlord from raising the rent, since they obviously have money to spare?

Principles? Morals? Ethics?

The small things preventing humanity from murdering, raping, enslaving, and torturing one another. It's easy to forget that these exist and that everyone must always be on guard, defending the world against ones own baser instincts and defending oneself against humanity at larges baser instincts. As we collectively forget, or consciously ignore, our duty to one another we mortgage humanities future with collective suffering today. Eventually the bill on these ills come due, one way or another the sociological debt is always repaid.

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#205

Here's an anecdote about what happens when you design a product in the opposite way. I own https://www.executeprogram.com , which has interactive in-browser courses on various software development technologies. Currently they all cover languages, more or less: TypeScript, SQL, various JS topics, regexes. (Disclosure: it costs money after you finish your 16th lesson.) Almost all (maybe literally all) of our competitor…

Uh, it's interesting that you see the design of your product as a counterexample, because to me it looks exactly like what mobile games have been doing as a mechanism for maximizing engagement. You want to stop them from playing through too much of the game's content and burning themselves out on it. So you lock them out with a timer, forcing them to come back later. Then you reward them for coming back every day. Th…

> You want to stop them from playing through too much of the game's content and burning themselves out on it. So you lock them out with a timer, forcing them to come back later. Then you reward them for coming back every day.

Simultaneously offering a pay-to-play option that enables the user to bypass the timeout with money

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not, though - that's the point. You're either a baker or you're a crack dealer - you don't get to be a baker that just sells a little crack, that's not how it works.

Isn't sugar a suitable substitute for crack?

Ever try scamming a crack addict with sugar?

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If that isn't addiction, I don't know what is. In my case, boredom. I normally fix that by reading books on my Kindle, but if I don't have it for some reason, the phone is a good substitute.

A few years ago, I realized that one of the reasons I felt tense and anxious and overwhelmed all the time was because I had a huge backlog of mental processing. It was like I had all of this sensory and information input coming in on a conveyor belt and not enough hands on the factory floor to go through, box up the useful stuff, and throw out the rest. So I just felt it all piling up in my head as this vague sense o…

As someone who has ADD, you just described my brain. For me, it's slightly better if I don't spend time on my phone, my brain does still get overloaded quickly though :)

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#208
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a family-run bakery near my house that specializes in cheesecakes. They make the best cheesecakes I've ever tasted. They only make a certain number (~200, say, I dunno really) per day, they always sell out, then they close for the day. Every year they take a two-month vacation. That's it. That's the whole business. Anthony Mangieri was downtown for a few years here in SF before he went back East. https://www.…

> sell out, then they close for the day. Every year they take a two-month vacation. What is stopping their landlord from raising the rent, since they obviously have money to spare?

Real estate prices depend on the market rate, not the buyer's wealth.

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then look at all the mental health problems young people are having these days Is there any evidence that mental health is worse than for previous generations?

Two sources that show anxiety and depression are on the rise with the youth. https://www.pewresearch.org/social-trends/2019/02/20/most-u-... https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/07/12/a-growing-n...

Well, you know, that could also be because the youth racks up student debt, can't afford to buy their own houses, are expected to slave away their life for sub minimal wage jobs etc.

Which is why I don't get why smartphones and social media are almost solely blamed in these kinds of discussion. We have COVID since one year, wealth gaps are getting bigger etc.

Re: “User engagement” is code for “addiction”

#210

A tangential point about the horrifying power of euphemism: I've done some consulting work with some large biopharmaceutical companies in the past and found myself consistently shocked at how effective euphemism was at making people comfortable talking about, and doing, very questionable things. E.g. "Maximizing treatment" = "extend how long a patient requires our medication". This was at a senior level and these wer…

My favorite example is the phrase “human resource”. If you reframe humans as resources, exploiting them is the next, natural step. Words matter. Corporate speak dehumanizes us all.

"final solution to the Jewish problem".. I wonder what they felt when people first learned what that implied
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