Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform • Hacker News Board

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#201

Post by cmrx64 » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 10:46 PM UTC

generalizations wrote: post #198

londons_explore wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thought experiment: There are 7e9 people on earth. Say they send 10, 100 byte messages per day, but that compresses 10x (modern text compression using big neural networks is amazing ). That works out to 7e11 bytes per day, or 8 Megabytes per second. That is nearly feasible today...

However, that's also 21 Terabytes per month. It'll be a while before that's feasible. Hopefully the population doesn't grow with our bandwidth capabilities.

the square kilometer array produces a terabyte a second. 21tb/mo is peanuts. we’ll get there :)

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#202

Post by Arathorn » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 10:53 PM UTC

jlkuester7 wrote: post #58

Arathorn wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://matrix.org/blog/2020/06/02/introducing-p-2-p-matrix/

Oh wow! I must have missed that somehow! Very interesting! I have been a fan of Matrix for a long time and have been very excited by all of the progress made recently! Particularly, the new UI experience for E2E encrypted channels is amazing! You managed to get solid security without sacrificing usability. Thank you for your dedication to Matrix and its community!

thanks :) There's still a way to go on E2EE UX and sadly, but we're working on it.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#203

Post by _jfoi » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 10:56 PM UTC

dr_kiszonka wrote: post #183

I wish they excluded extremes on both sides of the spectrum. Otherwise, it makes Cabal seem like a Parler for the extreme left. (Maybe it is not; I know nothing about people behind Cabal.)

Oh shut up. What a crybaby.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#204

Post by londons_explore » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 11:02 PM UTC

generalizations wrote: post #195

PurpleFoxy wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is exactly how bitmessage worked. The problem was that spammers would be able to flood the network with crap so to counter that it was added that proof of work must be completed to have your message forwarded on. The problem with this is it means you could not send a message from a mobile device because the PoW required was too high. Also a method to reduce the amount of traffic required was called streams. Inst…

> spammers would be able to flood the network with crap Would there be a legit motivation to do that? I get that it's a threat, but would it be possible to gain anything from DDOSing that network? Seems like either a) you come up with a system for banning spam IPs, or b) the spammers improve the anonymity of the rest of the network by creating more noise for the messages to hide in.

When you design a system for users to send short messages for free, there is always someone who says "I could split my hard drive into billions of tiny pieces and send them all!".

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#205

Post by jakear » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 11:04 PM UTC

generalizations wrote: post #195

PurpleFoxy wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is exactly how bitmessage worked. The problem was that spammers would be able to flood the network with crap so to counter that it was added that proof of work must be completed to have your message forwarded on. The problem with this is it means you could not send a message from a mobile device because the PoW required was too high. Also a method to reduce the amount of traffic required was called streams. Inst…

> spammers would be able to flood the network with crap Would there be a legit motivation to do that? I get that it's a threat, but would it be possible to gain anything from DDOSing that network? Seems like either a) you come up with a system for banning spam IPs, or b) the spammers improve the anonymity of the rest of the network by creating more noise for the messages to hide in.

Any state actors who like to snoop would be incentivized to cripple the snooping-free network for the low low price of a few high capacity links. (Or better yet very many low capacity links)

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#206

Post by meekmockmook » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 11:09 PM UTC

m1sta_ wrote: post #197

dr_kiszonka wrote: post #183

I wish they excluded extremes on both sides of the spectrum. Otherwise, it makes Cabal seem like a Parler for the extreme left. (Maybe it is not; I know nothing about people behind Cabal.)

Obvious conclusion since everything that isn't far-right is far-left. /s

I'm a Sanders supporter and as Left as it gets but there is serious denial about the past 6 months of coordinated violence in major city cores from militant groups that claimed to speak for me. We have a problem with Big Tech and sectarian violence in this country no matter which way you look at it.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#207

Post by torstenvl » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 11:16 PM UTC

ReactiveJelly wrote: post #128

Checked the FAQ. Downside: It doesn't support Tor and they don't seem to have any plan for that. So it's trusted-friends-only, IPs are always visible. Which is pointless for me, as a person trying to build healthy online friendships from behind Tor. Upside: I was afraid it's a reaction to Parler being deplatformed. And then I thought maybe it was a side-project of Urbit. But looking at the Values page: "No nazis, no…

[flagged]

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#208

Post by dragonwriter » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 11:17 PM UTC

meekmockmook wrote: post #206

m1sta_ wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obvious conclusion since everything that isn't far-right is far-left. /s

I'm a Sanders supporter and as Left as it gets but there is serious denial about the past 6 months of coordinated violence in major city cores from militant groups that claimed to speak for me. We have a problem with Big Tech and sectarian violence in this country no matter which way you look at it.

> I'm a Sanders supporter and as Left as it gets

I'm a Sanders supporter, and there's quite bit (obviously, alienated from the duopoly fostered by the structure of US government and elections) to the left of the left-most Sanders supporter.

> but there is serious denial about the past 6 months of coordinated violence in major city cores from militant groups that claimed to speak for me.

Since you don't claim to be from either the far-right groups that the many identified violent provocateurs represented, nor from the movement that the protestors represented (which wasn't either “the Left” in general, or Sanders supporters in particular—in fact, being in the overlap of the two groups, I'm very much aware that it's a group that has had a very conflicted relationship with Sanders and even moreso his largely-White and not particularly race conscious base of support), I’m not sure what your basis is for claiming that the supposed coordinated violence, no matter who you attribute it to (there has been considerable disagreement on that) was from people who claim to represent you.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#209

Post by lez » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 11:23 PM UTC

meekmockmook wrote: post #206

m1sta_ wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obvious conclusion since everything that isn't far-right is far-left. /s

I'm a Sanders supporter and as Left as it gets but there is serious denial about the past 6 months of coordinated violence in major city cores from militant groups that claimed to speak for me. We have a problem with Big Tech and sectarian violence in this country no matter which way you look at it.

As an insider do you see the current level of censorship from Big Tech to make the situation worse, better, or do you feel it doesn't matter?

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#210

Post by XorNot » Sun, Jan 10, 2021, 11:23 PM UTC

londons_explore wrote: post #180

londons_explore wrote: post #178

Network connections are getting faster... Peoples typing/reading speeds are not... One day it will be feasible for someone's phone to receive all messages sent by every other person on earth. They can then try to decode every message till they find one that their private key can decode. You've now made the perfect privacy messaging system - by sending all messages to all users, no quantity of network packet sniffing/…

Thought experiment: There are 7e9 people on earth. Say they send 10, 100 byte messages per day, but that compresses 10x (modern text compression using big neural networks is amazing ). That works out to 7e11 bytes per day, or 8 Megabytes per second. That is nearly feasible today...

Battery life is a problem though. Your phone running hot the entire time trying to decrypt every message in the stream becomes the new limiting factor.