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ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

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Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#201

Post by bllguo »

anctualprzn wrote: post #98
kelp wrote: post #66

I badly want this, but with Topre keys. I have a couple of Topre FC660Cs and absolutely love the feel, durability and quality of the keyboard. A split would be really nice though.

I'm with you. I have the FC660C. Loved the feel and sound, but the tiny form caused my RSI, which prompted me to buy an ErgoDox EZ. Had to go back to Cherry switches, but I would love some CYO Topre switches to throw in there. I wish there was a bigger market for CYO switches, but I haven't found anywhere to get them.

CYO meaning choose your own?

I wouldn't hold my breath on the Topre front, the company is notoriously conservative in their offerings. They're also not mechanical switches; there's really no way to offer hotswap Topre switches. But there is a whole world out there other than Topre and Cherry. And you can swap them out easily since you have an ergodox ez. You can buy mechanical switches from several hobby sites like https://novelkeys.xyz/collections/switches, it's pretty much plug and play

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#202

Post by wy35 »

johnm wrote: post #114
wy35 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I'm disappointed to see that this isn't a contoured keyboard -- still waiting for a contoured keyboard (e.g. Advantage2) with the customization of the ErgoDox without having to build it myself (e.g. Dactyl Manuform).

Do you only use the Advantage at home/work? I.e., what do you do when you're traveling (or just using your laptop away from you desk)?

I don't bother traveling with the Advantage2 at all... it's a bit too big to do that comfortably.

I find it pretty easy to switch between laptop keyboard and Advantage2, so no problems there. So the Advantage2 remains on my desk while I just use my laptop's keyboard for meetings/on-the-go. I think the layouts are so different, my brain processes them separately.

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#203

Post by xupybd »

nonbirithm wrote: post #165
tom_ wrote: post #76

I wish people would just copy the MS Natural Ergonomic 4000, but with better keyswitches. As things stand, every split keyboard with nice keyswitches has a different layout from every other, which is odd, considering how much this type of device relies on muscle memory to work. (Also, most of them miss one or more of F keys, symmetrical meta keys, standard navigation cluster layout, volume buttons - it's like they wa…

I want a more ergonomic keyboard since I may be developing wrist problems, but I don't understand why none of them seem to have function keys. I use the function keys all the time and when I switch to a 40% layout I get seriously annoyed by the lack of them and end up going back to a full layout keyboard because of it. I spent twenty minutes searching for a split keyboard with function keys and found only one thread…

Have you looked at the kenesis advantage? Solved my wrist problems and it has function keys.

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#204

Post by matttb »

victoriasun wrote: post #187
edanm wrote: post #174

I recently bought and Ergodox-EZ, after previously getting my first mechanical keyboard (the Ultimate Hacking Keyboard, which I love). I'm not a huge fan of it. So far, it seems like it's been a lot of work relearning habits, for little gain. But oddly enough, my biggest gripe with the Ergodox isn't something I've heard people complain about - the lack of an extra column of keys on the right part. Basically, on a nor…

Those far keys are usually triggered by your weakest fingers -- return, for example, is triggered via your pinky and can often require you to stretch your pinky (and ulnar nerve) in unergonomic ways, leading to Cubital Tunnel Syndrome. I find that a good introductory layout to this kind of keyboard is the Kinesis Advantage 2 [1]. As you can see a bunch of common keypresses usually delegated to the pinkies have been s…

This is exactly why I love my Ergodox. My biggest hand issue was pinky pain, and with the ergodox I've moved basically all of the 'stretch' pinky keys to thumb/index finger. In particular moving backspace/enter/ctrl to the thumb cluster makes me feel like I can never use a keyboard without one again. It's completely eliminated pinky pain on both of my hands.

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#205

Post by bostonvaulter2 »

benji-york wrote: post #125
arka2147483647 wrote: post #108

The thing i like best about ZSA, is that they are selling products. Just buy, configure with a nice web tool. No soldering, assembly or programming required to make it work. All other Ergodox, or Ergodox alternatives, seem like much more work to get working the way you want. Anyway, the thumb clusters were my primary annoyance with my Ergodox, so i ordered a Moonlander. I hope it works out.

For another take on thumb clusters, check out the Diverge: https://unikeyboard.io/product/diverge/

That layout looks nice! Would be good to compare it to the Moonlander, I wish there was somewhere I could try out these different keyboards in person.

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#206

Post by bostonvaulter2 »

mohaine wrote: post #59
wy35 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I'm disappointed to see that this isn't a contoured keyboard -- still waiting for a contoured keyboard (e.g. Advantage2) with the customization of the ErgoDox without having to build it myself (e.g. Dactyl Manuform).

This. After using Advantage2 for 10ish years I can't really go back to a flat keyboard. I liked my Keyboardio Model 1 but the Advantage2 is just more comfortable. I love the idea of customization but the flatness has me looking at all these as non-starters.

How does the customizability of the Advantage2 compare to the Ergodox EZ?

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#207

Post by daxelrod »

_ink_ wrote: post #67

Is there a similar keyboard in the $100 range? I do not need changeable keyswitches or an ARM processor in my keyboard. Currently I have the Microsoft natural ergonomic keyboard 4000 and I am quite happy with that. I just do not need a num block and think a split keyboard is easier for travelling. Are there any good split keyboards with hand rests in the $100 range?

The Kinesis Freestyle 2 [A] with the VIP3 Tenting Accessory[B] (for wrist rests and tenting) will run you $125 on Amazon.

It's got two independent halves that you can angle how you want, and put at actual shoulder width apart. It lacks the ortholinear layout, mechanical switches, and programmability of the Moonlander.

I went from the MS Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 (which I used for years and loved) to the Freestyle Pro (same layout, but with mechanical switches and programmability) and it made a huge difference in my posture and shoulder tension.

It definitely takes up less space than the MS 4000, but it's still two pretty bulky halves that don't pack up to travel particularly easily.

[A] https://kinesis-ergo.com/shop/freestyle2-for-pc-us/ [B] https://kinesis-ergo.com/shop/freestyle2-vip3-accessory/

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#208

Post by _lbaq »

rayshan wrote: post #77

I've been eyeing the Ergodox-EZ for a few months and this was an instant buy for me. Lately I've been rotating between TKL keyboards and the Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic, but my right wrist is still getting worse. I looked at over a dozen split keyboard options. Seems like no matter if you build or buy, it'll cost around $300. I decided I didn't want to also buy a soldering kit and wait months for parts to arrive. Here…

Try the Kinesis Advantage, got one with red switches, I do not type faster, but it’s very comfy for my old wrists and I do not make many mistakes. Bonus, the configuration is stored as text files that shows up in a “usb drive” on the desktop.

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#209

Post by yepguy »

Stop making split keyboards! You don't need 2 separate pieces; all you really need are slightly angled keys away from the center. See the Truly Ergonomic keyboard[1] for example.

That layout also has the advantage of being a design you could use for a laptop, if only manufacturers put actual effort into their laptop keyboards.

[1]: https://trulyergonomic.com/ergonomic-keyboards/

Re: ZSA Moonlander: A next-generation ergonomic keyboard

#210

Post by Borealid »

samgranieri wrote: post #83
jolmg wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, the wire between the two doesn't look that long. I wonder if it's a portable connector. From the bottom picture, it kind of looks like a headphone jack, but I'm doubting that's the case. I wish they'd have mentioned the connector type to see if there are alternative cables available. As it is, it seems too short to comfortably have each half to my sides when laying down.

It's probably a standard headphone jack like the one on my Ergodox EZ. The cable is removable

The Ergodox EZ actually uses a four-connector TRRS connector, not the three-connector TRS connector you use for ordinary stereo headphones.
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