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Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

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Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#201

Post by thestepafter »

softwaredoug wrote: post #44
softwaredoug wrote: post #30

God please don't make me use a non-zoom video conferencing tool! I have used about a dozen over the years in my role as a consultant, and Zoom has been by far the most reliable. I’m hopeful lots of good can come from the scrutiny, but please Zoom get your act together so I don’t have to use some other buggy thing that doesn’t actually work.

I knew I would get downvoted. But folks seriously don’t remember the pain before Zoom. And the current pain anytime we have to use a GoToMeeting, Google Meet, Webex or other tool that barely functions. Human interaction that actually works right now is so important. And I simply have a hard time trusting another product to actually do the call reliably

I just switched to GoToMeeting and they have improved significantly since the last time I used them (before Zoom). New interface, transcription, unlimited recorded meetings in the cloud, great audio so far, I’m happy.

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#202

Post by monkeydust »

I work at a large corp, our own in house video conf went down for a few hours. Our backup conference system also tied to same system of course went down. Rather than postpone meetings we took them on zoom. It just works and I hope they get over this security issue and start ramping up their feature set.

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#203

Post by reubenmorais »

StudentStuff wrote: post #114
gnicholas wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> because then you're forced to dial in, which just puts you at a disadvantage when everyone can see everyone's face except yours. Can't they just participate in a call from the browser? I thought Google only banned the application/app, not usage of the service altogether.

The browser version of Zoom seems to require a free account be created, and it was audio only in Chromium, I could not get it to use my camera. Zoom refused to work in Firefox. Jitsi and Google Meet seem to work in both browsers, without requiring me to log in.

It's improved a bit, and actually works fine in Firefox Nightly right now, but you have to craft the web client URL directly. The UI will try its very best to make you download the client.

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#205

Post by kinkrtyavimoodh »

mulmen wrote: post #38
kinkrtyavimoodh wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Googlers don't use Zoom for company work. It was banned as in it can no longer be installed on corp laptops.

Right but it's also astonishing that was allowed before. If it's not needed for work why would it be installed? Why would any non-work software be allowed on corp laptops?

Google has always had the company culture of not infantilizing their employees and broadly trusting them to do the right thing. This reflects in many many policies and general 'culture'. You can install software on the laptop as long as you have the right license for it, and there are centralized tools to check for potentially dangerous binaries and things like that.

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#206

Post by darkwater »

gamblor956 wrote: post #180
tazjin wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google Meet is the only one of these that has always worked reliably for me. Doesn't require any strange clients, works in most browsers, never randomly fails to move just some person's audio and so on. Disclaimer: I work for Alphabet, but already held this opinion before I did.

I have never gotten Google Meet to work in Firefox. Or the new Edge for that matter, despite it using the Chromium engine. It seems to work only in Chrome and Safari.

I find this amusing because I regularly use Meet on Firefox and Linux.

My pet peeve with Meet by the way is the absence of a native grid view in big rooms.

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#207

Post by jMyles »

Mvandenbergh wrote: post #196
jMyles wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google's threat model may not be your threat model, and it definitely isn't the threat model of my daughter's school. A corporation like Google may be concerned using native applications, written in unsafe languages, written by developers from other corporations in China. That said, Zoom isn't wrong for everyone. Google's threat model surely differs in some way from a school, but the specific threats you named seem…

The threat model for a school is kids/others disrupting sessions and creepers using access to gawp at (or communicate with kids). Since the Chinese government is unlikely to feel the need to compel Zoom to do that, the fact that they have all the keys centrally stored is not a problem. Google's threat model actually does include state level attack (And specifically by China) to steal IP or access confidential user da…

> The threat model for a school is kids/others disrupting sessions and creepers using access to gawp at (or communicate with kids).

Not if the school actually cares about the future of its students.

From a blog post[0] we published at NuCypher a while back:

> If we fail to take action now, we risk a world in which unsavory actors - domestic and foreign - have built rich, comprehensive profiles for every one of our children, following the trajectories of their education, home life, consumer habits, health, and on and on. These profiles will then be used to manipulate their behavior not only as consumers, but as voters and participants in all those corners of society which, in order for freedom and justice to prevail, require instead that these kids mature into functional, free-thinking adults.

0: https://blog.nucypher.com/todays-kids-need-end-to-end-encryp...

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#208

Post by sp332 »

buboard wrote: post #188
walrus01 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> God please don't make me use a non-zoom video conferencing tool! I have honestly lost track of the amount of software I've seen in the past 20 years, that people insist they absolutely must continue to use despite its well documented gaping security flaws. Because it has a better UI or makes their life very slightly more convenient in some way. Versions of Microsoft Office from the early 2000s where an entire opera…

their popularity was the reason why there were so many exploits

So many? I thought there were two, and I wouldn't call either of them "gaping" as GP did. https://techcrunch.com/2020/04/01/zoom-doom/

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#209

Post by walrus01 »

pfranz wrote: post #197
walrus01 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> God please don't make me use a non-zoom video conferencing tool! I have honestly lost track of the amount of software I've seen in the past 20 years, that people insist they absolutely must continue to use despite its well documented gaping security flaws. Because it has a better UI or makes their life very slightly more convenient in some way. Versions of Microsoft Office from the early 2000s where an entire opera…

What are you advocating for? Either way business will continue; lock down security and people (and productivity) will suffer but still continue, ignore security and business will still happen. Different business will fail in each scenario, but the world won't end. Heck, force people to jump through hoops to support insecure software and work still gets done: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22804208 I hope Zoom g…

I am specifically advocating that organizations with important data to protect take a more cautious and measured approach to installing software on their workstation computers.

If the very slight productivity hit from having slightly-more-blocky video chat in a slightly-more-awkward GUI client (google hangouts meet for gsuite, for instance, or Teams) is the make-or-break line between a company's continuing success, or not, with everyone working remotely, something else is fundamentally wrong that has no relation to any software package.

Re: Google bans Zoom from employees' computers

#210

Post by QUFB »

jMyles wrote: post #103
QUFB wrote: post #83

Some thoughts: 1. Google's threat model may not be your threat model, and it definitely isn't the threat model of my daughter's school. A corporation like Google may be concerned using native applications, written in unsafe languages, written by developers from other corporations in China. That said, Zoom isn't wrong for everyone. 2. Google is motivated to push their own solution for obvious reasons. 3. Tavis, or oth…

> Google's threat model may not be your threat model, and it definitely isn't the threat model of my daughter's school. A corporation like Google may be concerned using native applications, written in unsafe languages, written by developers from other corporations in China. That said, Zoom isn't wrong for everyone. Google's threat model surely differs in some way from a school, but the specific threats you named seem…

Understood, it differs, I just made a very brief comment and mentioned a couple of obvious threats!

For those that use Zoom - consider spending at least a few minutes to make a mental threat model about Zoom. Who might go after you? What features does Zoom have that might be exploitable? What's the worst thing that can happen? The worst case for Google is not the same as the worst case for a professor or elementary school.

Maybe Zoom doesn't work for your use case - fine!

Maybe Zoom is good for your use case - fine!

Lots of people will be using it either way, so it's good to have Alex help lock it down.

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