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The Fantasy of Opting Out

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201–205 of 205 posts

Re: The Fantasy of Opting Out

#201
post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> The Magna Carta was written in response to an awful king, the FDA was established as a response to widespread problems with people getting poisoned, slavery wasn't abolished until millenia after it was invented, and labor organization (leading to such modern niceties as the 40 hour week) did not arise until well after the industrial revolution. Give it time. > I think you’re right but the problem is that this time…

Oh of course, but those who had not yet been poisoned were protected. I guess I'm agreeing with you and adding the caveat that nearly everyone is already poisoned.

I guess the hope at this point is that our children won't be.

I miss the vibe of the late 90s and early 00s. I remember feeling like sure the world is fucked both socially and environmentally but that things would improve. The bad old lot would be kicked out, the internet would spread freedom and understanding, science would advance and we would all prosper. Hell I remember being a kid back then and being frustrated by all the environmental themes in media back then because of course we should all care about that sort of thing, it was obvious. Same as I remember getting sick of all the "don't be racist/homophobic" very special episodes for the same reason - obviously they were preaching to the choir right?

Well now environmentalism seems to have fallen off and the planet is fucked.

People are saying white men are to blame for everything or instead saying it is the fault of women and immigrants.

The internet is instead a collection of platforms that are safe space echo chambers and is full of toxic culture wars.

Science marches on and it brings us drone strikes, China's social credit system, a surveillance state, and the expectation we are always available to answer work emails.

I want to get off this ride.

Re: The Fantasy of Opting Out

#202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article's point is that individual actions really don't scale. This is a general problem of race-to-the-bottom dynamics -- a form of Gresham's Law. At best, personal resistance simply opens more space for the bad actors / RTTB dynamic. Instituting systemic blocks, through regulation, legislation, taboo, or other mechanisms, is required. Individual action can help spread awareness. But it's a first step, not a las…

I guess in that case I'd be interested in hearing more about the "other mechanisms".

Anything that's systemic and collective rather than individual.

A few come to mind, but the primary intent was to indicate my list was not comprehensive.

Re: The Fantasy of Opting Out

#203
post #37

With a clamor of bells that set the swallows soaring, the Festival of Summer came to the city Omelas, bright-towered by the sea. The rigging of the boats in harbor sparkled with flags. In the streets between houses with red roofs and painted walls, between old moss-grown gardens and under avenues of trees, past great parks and public buildings, processions moved. Some were decorous: old people in long stiff robes of…

I'm gathering some people here aren't familiar with Ursula K. LeGuin's short-story epic. It's a bit of a stretch for this particular post, but I think there's a connection which can be made.

It is indeed a story about "opting out". I was hoping it would spur a little discussion. It's not exactly a long read, but I guess too long for the attention span of the current crowd.

Everyone in modern society has chosen not to walk away from Omelas. Every day we live on the backs of untold suffering - actual peasants and literal slave labor who mine our minerals and manufacture our goods.

The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas personifies that as a single child, whose suffering we all know. And yet our banners could not be as bright or our people as happy if we didn't.

We of course all identify with the ones who walk away, yet none of us choose to do so. It's a thought-provoking piece.

Re: The Fantasy of Opting Out

#204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess in that case I'd be interested in hearing more about the "other mechanisms".

Anything that's systemic and collective rather than individual. A few come to mind, but the primary intent was to indicate my list was not comprehensive.

I understand that, I just feel like the others in your list have tended to fail to produce change (regulation, legislation, taboo), via regulatory capture, K-street and money influence on congress, and media manipulation, respectively. So I am more interested in anything you might consider to go in the other category. Not looking for a comprehensive list, just something to get started with.

Re: The Fantasy of Opting Out

#205
post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm gathering some people here aren't familiar with Ursula K. LeGuin's short-story epic. It's a bit of a stretch for this particular post, but I think there's a connection which can be made.

It is indeed a story about "opting out". I was hoping it would spur a little discussion. It's not exactly a long read, but I guess too long for the attention span of the current crowd. Everyone in modern society has chosen not to walk away from Omelas. Every day we live on the backs of untold suffering - actual peasants and literal slave labor who mine our minerals and manufacture our goods. The Ones Who Walk Away Fr…

I think it got interpreted as copypasta, of which there's been some uptick.

I got the point. Then again, I've also walked away, at least from much of the tech Omelas.

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