Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile • Hacker News Board

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#201

Post by AnthonyMouse » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 3:10 PM UTC

_cs2017_ wrote: post #156

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're overcomplicating it somewhat by separating things out that could reasonably just be averaged together. The real question is what the supply and demand curves look like. It's possible for everyone to make more money by reducing prices and making it up on volume, if that's what happens. If you're a driver and you currently spend a lot of time sitting around waiting for riders, and the lower prices reduce that wa…

I agree with you. I guess I'm asking how likely is the (quite appealing) scenario you describe? The volume increase will more than offset the price drop -- otherwise Uber would have no incentive to drop the price in the first place. What else do we need to know to predict the outcome on drivers pay?

Predicting this kind of stuff is a rabbit hole. Suppose there is a strip of struggling restaurants downtown in an area with insufficient parking, so that your ride service is the best way to get there. If you lower prices by $.10/mile, you just lose money. If you lower prices by $.20/mile, the lower transportation cost allows the restaurants get enough new customers that they can make improvements, and then the restaurant improvements attract even more customers. Those customers are also your customers, and having many customers going to and from the same small area is your best case scenario because it allows you to pick up and drop off in the same place at the same time, so then you make more money too.

It's generally easier to just try it and see what happens, and then deduce the how from the what. Note however that this will not necessarily be the same thing that happens in another area or at another time, because of all the things that can be different and affect the outcome.

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#202

Post by troydavis » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 3:25 PM UTC

https://therideshareguy.com/uber-lowering-rates/ is a detailed analysis of these (or very similar) changes. It's more complex than this headline or article makes it seem. The gist is that, at least in the markets covered by TheRideShareGuy's article, mileage rates are going down a little and time rates are going up significantly.

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#203

Post by ed_balls » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 3:26 PM UTC

hopler wrote: post #182

seibelj wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m sorry about your brother, but I’m not going say Uber’s responsible for his heart attacks and pack a day cigarette habit. Uber might be short changing him on money but you can’t blame them for poor lifestyle decisions.

Uber did destroy his industry.

Uber did not destroy his industry. Industry is flourishing. It's state's fault for not providing a good social safety net. Imagine if we all had to use horses, because the government did not want to "destroy" the industry.

We all know what is the end game here. Driving a vehicle will be recreational activity.

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#204

Post by ed_balls » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 3:29 PM UTC

adamqureshi wrote: post #118

My brother works for uber, He is 54 years old smokes a pack day and has had 2 heart attacks. He drives a Cadillac and pays $500-month for commercial insurance and has a monthly payment for his car. He has TLC plates to work in NYC ( fees apply) he makes about $300 a day works like a dog 12-14 hours a day. All of his friends are the same (uber drivers in NYC) Here you have the typical uber driver who does this for a l…

> he makes about $300 a day works like a dog 12-14 hours a da

Is this profit, revenue or in transactions?

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#205

Post by jtms » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 3:40 PM UTC

russdpale wrote: post #86

usaphp wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know what you do but to me working as a programmer, thinking all day and solving problems, is much harder than just driving around people.

Yeh but so is loading 1000 packages into 4 or 5 trucks. Or 2500 packages into an 18 wheeler.

Hard, yes, but you should start a business paying people developer salaries to load and unload boxes and we will see how well that works out for you. Also that job is soon to be an anachronism - robots are perfectly suited to replace humans for this task.

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#206

Post by jtms » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 3:41 PM UTC

Pxtl wrote: post #76

Sooner or later the us is going to have to sit down and have a long and hard conversation about this "independent contractor" nonsense.

Why do you think it’s even a remotely good idea to tell people when, where, and how they spend their time and energy?

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#207

Post by ddingus » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 3:42 PM UTC

jtms wrote: post #198

ddingus wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps a collective makes more sense here. Someone should explore doing it. I like the services, and many drivers like the work, but almost all of them hate the pay and overall relationship.

Then they should seek alternatives. Electing to not participate in a voluntary agreement is always an option.

No, sorry. Given the terrible job scenario and way too suppressed wages, "voluntary" is too much of a reach.

Seeking alternatives in tandem with regulation?

Yeah. Us all saying these over exploitative companies are OK?

No way.

Fact is, these companies, and many others, simply do not have to be as toxic to people as they are, and because of that, I am perfectly fine with attempts to clean things up.

Or, they can do it.

I do not care which, only that improvement happens.

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#208

Post by PopeDotNinja » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 4:25 PM UTC

jtms wrote: post #196

abernard1 wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to put an alternative view here. My guess is Uber has actually done enough legwork and figured out that contrary to these sob stories in the press, there are more than enough drivers that 1) have efficient vehicles that are cheaper to operate and 2) are willing to work for that profit in quantities to cover demand. If the rates Uber is providing drivers are so dismal they're protesting in the street, frankl…

Right?? So many commenters are acting as if these drivers are somehow obligated to work there. Just. Go. Elsewhere. You are not entitled to the perfect job simply because you are alive. What the hell happened to personally responsibility/accountability?

The solution to getting a better job is not simply leaving your current job. A lot of people have a shit job because they can't get a better job. A lot if people are homeless because they can't get a job at all. It's not that damn simple.

Source: white middle class male in San Francisco couldn't get a job for most if 2009, eventually ended up homeless.

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#209

Post by petschge » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 4:42 PM UTC

jtms wrote: post #197

Phlarp wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It'd be illegal in this country if not for some very creative stepping around the issue on the part of the "gig economy". (Which may itself be illegal but it appears Uber has become to large for this to matter)

Its a voluntary agreement between two parties - they should be able to make whatever deal they want as long as both parties are amenable. If not amenable, go elsewhere.

They don't agree voulnatrily on that low payoiut per mile because Uber and indivudual drivers have very different bargaining power. A free market can only exist between well-informed rational actors that can both walk away from the deal. In the face of huge power disparities you need limits on the power of the stronger player for a long term market to exist. This is exactly what minimum wage is. So don't trode out the tried old propaganda of cut-throat capitalists such as "they took the deal".

Re: Uber is dropping rates for drivers down from 80 cents/mile to 60 cents/mile

#210

Post by caprese » Sun, Mar 31, 2019, 7:08 PM UTC

hopler wrote: post #180

caprese wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Exploit them for a while and when they realize they aren’t making money Between all the happy drivers who you begin to notice are just 2 weeks in, and also knowing they are homeless while they are driving in this area makes it harder to support the service But there is also a reason they drove 100 miles from Sacramento and turned on the app.

You could tip your driver if you believe they deserve higher pay.

when I say "support" this is more about imagining whether it is a sustainable business model or not and just enjoying the luxury while it lasts