Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have yet to see a long term project built with Redux that was maintainable. That seems to be the common denominator in React projects that do not survive technical debt accumulation. The issue with Redux is that it encourages side effects in components. After a while people are dispatching all over the place and you end up in a similar situation as you were with keeping track of JavaScript events. All of a sudden s…
> The issue with Redux is that it encourages side effects in components. Which is why a lot of people that encourage Redux tend to also encourage one or more of the "side effect" managers such as thunks, sagas, or observables (my preference).
None of my projects want to be SPAs
201–210 of 362 posts
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#202Maybe that'll change if I decide to build games with HTML/JavaScript/CSS or want to make some sort of online version of a desktop program, but nothing in my current ideas list is app like enough to really warrant the SPA setup.
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#203Earlier quoted context omitted.
The other day I was arguing this exactly in a thread here about Ruby. People argue that Rails is outdated and is irrelevant for "modern web development", even though the web is not as modern as most people might think. Even what Facebook does, the only really hard part is the sheer scale they operate at. Facebook (the website) is not a single page app and other than the scale could be done in Rails with some AJAX spr…
In order to have dynamic UI you either have to use jQuery or SPA library like Vue or similar. For me the major advantage of vuejs over jquery is the way data drives UI
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#204This may be a mean thing to say, but basically I think SPA's are massively overused, because developers want to demonstrate that they can do them. Why? Because big companies like Facebook and Google use them. Why? Because they actually are doing things that require them. 99% of the SPAs in production are things that should have been done the old Rails/Django/Laravel way, but that would not set you up as a developer w…
I mean for SEO sure, but I usually am not concerned with SEO at all.
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#205This may be a mean thing to say, but basically I think SPA's are massively overused, because developers want to demonstrate that they can do them. Why? Because big companies like Facebook and Google use them. Why? Because they actually are doing things that require them. 99% of the SPAs in production are things that should have been done the old Rails/Django/Laravel way, but that would not set you up as a developer w…
> I have also witnessed discussions where management admits that they want something done in an SPA so that they can show that work to their investors, as a means of getting funding to do other projects. Absolutely. This extends well beyond SPAs, too, in my experience. I recently burned part of a month explaining to my senior management chain why you don't just, literally, "do machine learning." Of course, it turns o…
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#206This may be a mean thing to say, but basically I think SPA's are massively overused, because developers want to demonstrate that they can do them. Why? Because big companies like Facebook and Google use them. Why? Because they actually are doing things that require them. 99% of the SPAs in production are things that should have been done the old Rails/Django/Laravel way, but that would not set you up as a developer w…
And yeah, they're also common in situations where they're not the right solution because either devs want to turn their current employer into the next Google, want to build up the CV to look good when interviewing for Google or have a boss/investors who like shiny things in general.
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#207> It beats being a Magpie Developer. I have more time time to pet my dog, read a lot of books, make fresh pasta by hand, and circle a more slowly evolving collection of powerful technologies that let’s me get stuff done without spending half my free time chasing shiny new things. Saying stuff like this is sure to please the hacker-news hipsters. But... is this honestly anyone's experiencing using new web technologies…
> The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool.
I fear that this wasn't meant to be ironic.
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#208This may be a mean thing to say, but basically I think SPA's are massively overused, because developers want to demonstrate that they can do them. Why? Because big companies like Facebook and Google use them. Why? Because they actually are doing things that require them. 99% of the SPAs in production are things that should have been done the old Rails/Django/Laravel way, but that would not set you up as a developer w…
Yeah, some people go so far as to directly claim that something is good because Google uses it. And when Google uses it, it probably IS good for solving Google's problems. But most people aren't Google and don't have Google's problems.
Angular everything and everywhere and sprinkle it with Material Design!
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#209Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The issue with Redux is that it encourages side effects in components. Which is why a lot of people that encourage Redux tend to also encourage one or more of the "side effect" managers such as thunks, sagas, or observables (my preference).
Why use a tool to solve a problem with another tool, rather than using tools that don't have the problem in the first place?
From my perspective, React is the thing with the problem: it doesn't have great state management for complex tasks / multi-component coordination. What I want to use is something like RxJS to manage such interactions and state, because it gives me a lot of power/control in a relatively easy way. One of the best options out there that I've seen is redux-observable, and thus Redux itself is just the "stuff inside the oreo" gluing React to all my interesting "epics" describing high level functionality in the applications.
It's also the Unix philosophy thing of use tools that "do one thing well" and then chain them together. React does view components rather well, Redux does state management rather well, Redux-Observable does state "interaction" rather well. Chained together they work remarkably well.
Re: None of my projects want to be SPAs
#210One option is to become a programmer for hire. You keep your skills up, and those skills are as much about getting a job as doing the job. You re-study data structures and algorithms. You can permute sets, find matching subtrees in binary search trees, and answer questions about how addresses in web browsers are resolve to web sites. You learn java, then GWT, then EJB, then spring, then struts, then you add a 2 to the end of struts, then Rails or Django, then you give it all up and do it again in Javascript, React, Vue, Ember. You also play the agile "estimate roulette" as you write down tasks and expected completion times in JIRA, and are asked about deadlines every morning in an almost inevitable corruption of the original methodology[1].
You would never do this for your own project. If you had an exciting new idea, the last thing you would do is go off and learn to find all subsets of a larger set that, when concatenated, form a member or the larger set, at the whiteboard, in 45 minutes. It's also fairly unlikely that you'd set out to write an SPA for many business ideas. But you'd definitely be doing this if you were applying for the next job, which you sort of always are doing, if you're a programmer for money. Even if you aren't looking to change jobs, you still do this, by and large.
Or, you can become the kind of programmer who creates a product, chooses the right tool for the task, and makes it work. The reason that this is difficult is that these jobs are rare. To really have this option, you often need to make the leap into doing your own thing.
That sort of entrepreneurial skill and mind-set seems to be orthogonal to most programmers. I couldn't tell you if it's innate or learned, but I do know that it's a big leap, involves risk, requires a period of economic uncertainty that is tough for people with dependents (or people just trying to pay rent and make it through the next few months in an expensive city). But it may be the best way out of the programmer-for-money quagmire.
The thing is, if you have that kind of entrepreneurial spirit... well I'm not sure you really need to be a programmer at all, there are all kinds of great opportunities out there.
[1] Yes, this is a bad case. Not a worst case, but a pretty bad one. I'd say all programmers for money have gone through some version of this more than once, but I'm putting them all together into something that is more grim than most have to put up with.