Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech

#201

Post by AnimalMuppet » Sat, Dec 29, 2018, 4:29 PM UTC

spookthesunset wrote: post #198

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good. Seriously. It's good that you're not a racist scumbag. But the actual quality of you as a human being wasn't the issue. The issue is that, if you're going to block speech by scumbags, there is someone who is going to consider you a scumbag. If you allow speech from scumbags to get blocked, then you need the people controlling the blocking to have the right ideas of who is a scumbag. Will the right people be the…

Honestly? I don’t give a crap what private company blocks and bans folks in the alt right. More the marrier. In fact, I wish all companies took a stand against the alt-right. Even if the government started to persecute them, I wouldn’t care. They are all my enemy and I view them as an existential threat to myself, my family and my country. Appeals to the Slippery slope argument doesn’t register with me anymore. They…

By defending their freedom of speech, I am defending my freedom of speech. I may not care about theirs, but I care about mine.

And for you to not be worried about this being used against you... you just said that these people are in power. That means that they at least have the capability of using it against you in the near future.

Re: Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech

#202

Post by AnimalMuppet » Sat, Dec 29, 2018, 4:30 PM UTC

mkhpalm wrote: post #199

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's true to a degree. But a lot of people are also legitimately troubled by the Russian use of the media to stir up trouble. Personally, I'm in favor of free speech. I'm not in favor of being inundated by manipulative propaganda from a foreign power. I don't know how to reconcile those two views. I mean, I guess I'm in favor of curtailing dishonest advertising, and that's kind of what propaganda is, but... I'm not…

Do you have any evidence of a foreign power inundating the public with propaganda through our media?

If by "media" you include Facebook, I would say yes, we do.

Re: Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech

#203

Post by John_KZ » Sat, Dec 29, 2018, 7:52 PM UTC

throw2016 wrote: post #158

There is a lot of apologism for censorship on this thread in sharp contrast to the threads on china and others where they are demonized for the exact same thing. This is troubling as it seems when we do it commentators are ready with a litany of justifications in contrast to the blanket judgements on other discussions. This kind of double standards is abusive of discourse and the values sought to be defended and cann…

HN is right-biased and quite nationalist.I'm always amused to realize that some people actually believe that Facebook's "moderation efforts" are a good think, while WeChat's or VK's are not.

I mean, I get why an exec or a politician would have to say this in public, but come on, who actually buys this? Facebook is no less of a propaganda tool for an authoritarian elite than it's Chinese or Russian counterparts. And even if you're a nationalist American, don't forget that Facebook isn't really protecting your own interests.

Re: Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech

#204

Post by sunsetMurk » Sat, Dec 29, 2018, 10:34 PM UTC

nradov wrote: post #176

sunsetMurk wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but what about seriously brainstorming some hypothetical scenarios as part of the process? For example, documenting some sort of 'ideal' or 'pro/con' type lists of potential fallout. When architecting a system.. or in design/feature proposals. Surely folks less in the weeds of technical requirements and actual implementation could help decide earlier on if something is 'good'.

Brainstorming hypothetical scenarios usually results in endless discussions about imaginary problems that never come to pass, and completely missing the real problems. This tends to happen regardless of who participates.

agreed. ...I guess why not have people who're better at it or who'd rather spend time on it, do it? Would probably miss most of the real problems, but could catch a few and help steer complex issues. I guess I'm thinking about it as applying the type of mission that OpenAI has[1] on a wider/smaller scale.

1- https://openai.com/about/#mission

Re: Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech

#205

Post by nradov » Sun, Dec 30, 2018, 5:26 AM UTC

sunsetMurk wrote: post #204

nradov wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Brainstorming hypothetical scenarios usually results in endless discussions about imaginary problems that never come to pass, and completely missing the real problems. This tends to happen regardless of who participates.

agreed. ...I guess why not have people who're better at it or who'd rather spend time on it, do it? Would probably miss most of the real problems, but could catch a few and help steer complex issues. I guess I'm thinking about it as applying the type of mission that OpenAI has[1] on a wider/smaller scale. 1- https://openai.com/about/#mission

The OpenAI people mean well but their their concerns over safety seem a bit silly considering they haven't actually demonstrated any progress toward building a true AGI. At this stage it's the equivalent of worrying about the problems that would be caused by an alien invasion: an interesting intellectual exercise but useless in practical terms.

Re: Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech

#206

Post by olefoo » Sun, Dec 30, 2018, 5:52 AM UTC

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #90

olefoo wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I were to post here linking your legal name and identifying information and residence to this post and issuing a call to have you disemployed and harassed at home; evicted if possible and subjected to a general boycott covering everything from sex to food. You would object strenuously. Yet I would only be engaging in "free speech".

I don't think this is as great of a counterpoint as you seem to think it is. All of the information you state is public record, and for someone like me who always uses my real name, I'm not concerned about people knowing it. You are free to call whomever you like to say I should be "disemployed and harassed at home" but making fraudulent claims and engaging in harassment can be handled like it always has, by me calli…

The point I was trying to make is that some forms of speech are violence ( in the action intended to cause harm sense ).

Re: Facebook’s Secret Rulebook for Global Political Speech

#207

Post by scarejunba » Mon, Dec 31, 2018, 10:02 PM UTC

pjc50 wrote: post #156

scarejunba wrote: post #144

How does everyone have so much trouble with Facebook and Twitter? I have both and have used both for years and I know that both require you to pick what you want to look at. I exhaust my Twitter feed in seconds and then have nothing to look at. Both my FB feed and my Twitter feed are more heartwarming, adorable, funny, or touching than angry or whatever. Maybe all of this is just a reflection of who you guys are. And…

You're not popular enough. > unfollow In the nastier situations, it's not people who you follow that's the problem. It's the people who @ you from a constant stream of new accounts.

You can block that on both platforms AFAIR.