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John McCain has died

nytimes.com

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Re: John McCain has died

#201

Post by emmelaich »

BoysenberryPi wrote: post #4

John McCain did somethings that I disagree with but the one thing I will always remember is when during the 2008 election there were multiple times during town halls and rallies that people would verbally attack Obama and McCain always shut them down without fail.

McCain was an honorable man. But not the only one. Guess who said these words:

> It will be a stirring sight to watch President Obama, his wife, Michelle, and their beautiful girls step through the doors of the White House. I know millions of Americans will be overcome with pride at this inspiring moment that so many have awaited so long.

Re: John McCain has died

#202

Post by leonroy »

emmelaich wrote: post #201
BoysenberryPi wrote: post #4

John McCain did somethings that I disagree with but the one thing I will always remember is when during the 2008 election there were multiple times during town halls and rallies that people would verbally attack Obama and McCain always shut them down without fail.

McCain was an honorable man. But not the only one. Guess who said these words: > It will be a stirring sight to watch President Obama, his wife, Michelle, and their beautiful girls step through the doors of the White House. I know millions of Americans will be overcome with pride at this inspiring moment that so many have awaited so long.

George W. Bush for those googling.

Re: John McCain has died

#203

Post by norcalkc »

mnm1 wrote: post #196
myrandomcomment wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am glad in hindsight your understanding of the situation was so clear. I promise you at the time things where not a black and white. Also he joined the military as a graduate of the Navy Academy way before the war in Vietnam was a real thing. He was a brave, honorable man deserving of our respect. It is easy to sit back after the fact and make grand judgments. “John McCain and I were members of different generation…

There's nothing respectable or heroic about any war. The longer we keep pushing this narrative about soldiers being heroes, the longer we get stuck in this mentality that it's somehow justified or reasonable to start wars, of which we have started so many it's almost impossible to count at this point. Despite his experiences in war and being tortured in Vietnam, he still supported torture and other hideous practices.…

Any man or woman that signs up to give up their life for their country is a hero. Period. Soldiers don’t start wars. Soldiers, however, many a times, do give ultimate sacrifices in them.

Re: John McCain has died

#204

Post by kchhina »

danso wrote: post #96
tzs wrote: post #37

The comment section on the story about this on Foxnew.com [1] is eye-opening. At the moment it is about 1/3 celebrating his death and complaining that he was really a RINO or closet liberal, 1/3 not commenting on his death but complaining about the RINO/closet liberal stuff, and 1/3 expressing sorrow at his death. [1] http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/08/25/john-mccain-dead-... Addendum: the comments section seems…

I wouldn't judge too much from a comments section. Seems like those attract the worst of the Internet, no matter what the subject.

You do realize you’re commenting in a comment section, right? :-)

Re: John McCain has died

#205

Post by tomaskafka »

arcticbull wrote: post #178
LanceH wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I maintain this was a major reason for Bush defeating Kerry. I saw news stories on both of them one night and they were both in jeans. Kerry looked like they were purchased so he could dress down as the people do. The jeans looked like they had never been worn, maybe a dress shirt tucked in. Bush on the other hand was at Camp David casually talking to the press outdoors while his dog happily circled him. It's not rea…

This is a genuine question, I'm not leading here. Do you think this has to do with anti-intellectualism, jealousy or is there more at play here? I wouldn't want an average joe to run the country, I want someone truly extraordinary. Better suited to the role, more experienced, smarter, better dressed and showing it. I don't want the stereotypical truck stop waiter/waitress, you know? It's not fair as they may be just…

I think it's simpler - we just want to know that whoever leads understands our perspective. Being relatable is a very strong (and yes, fakeable) signal.

Re: John McCain has died

#206

Post by scarface74 »

dragonwriter wrote: post #191
tooltalk wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

McCain was in the wrong party.

No, McCain was very much a Republican by policy positions; sure, he wasn't completely lockstep, but outside of rhetoric he'd usually fall into the standard Republican position in substance. His notable maverick positions weren't mostly in between the typical R & D positions but instead things that were controversial in both parties. Yeah, post-Trump he may seem to have been in the wrong party, but post-Trump even muc…

There are two types of Republicans. There are the standard pro military, pro business, pro sensible immigration, pro trade conservatives. Those are the type that usual rise to prominence nationally.

But then you have the Southern Republicans who use to be Democrats before the Civil Rights Era in the 60s - the Confederate Flag waving, “Moral Majority”, hate immigrants, anti-trade populists, who see the world changing and “ruining American culture”.

But when I look at the Republican Party today, I don’t recognize it. How did they get overtaken by The far right? If they had focused more on rural America instead of big business would that have helped?

Yes my view of the Republican Party has always been viewed through the lense of keeping southern republicans out of power - no matter if the Republican Party had some ideas I agreed with.

Democrats on the other hand are just weak and don’t have the courage of their convictions. They could easily have brought the middle class and rural America and minorities together. Except for the South, until the demographics change, there was no way a Black man was ever going to win the southern states.

Re: John McCain has died

#207

Post by scarface74 »

da_chicken wrote: post #113
scarface74 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

McCain presidential run is a perfect display of one of the weaknesses of the primary system. To win as Republican in the primary you have to appeal to the worse stereotypes of the Republican Party - racist, nationalist, “Christian right” etc. Neither McCain nor Romney ever governed to the far right but they had to pretend like they were to appeal to primary voters. I’m in no way giving Democrats a pass, they have to…

I'm not really sure that's a weakness. Sure, you can point to the things that are used which are harmful or hateful, but this is how a party decides it's policy. The idea is that the platform you pick informs the government you create, yes? Sure, you can argue about whether it's "listening" or "pandering," but the whole foundation of representative government is that the officials elected represent the policies the p…

Not really, Reagan, and the Bushes may have paid lip service to the “moral majority” but they never governed that way. Every modern Republican president supported sensible immigration for instance.

I know it seems like I’m giving Democrats a pass, but living in a southern state, I don’t see Democrats veer to far to the left on the state level. They can’t and still have any chance.

Re: John McCain has died

#210

Post by j7ake »

hirundo wrote: post #55

John McCain, a hero of a lost war, a senator whose signature law was overturned, a contender in a lost presidential race. For all of his integrity, accomplishment and hard work his life's efforts were largely futile. Except for his family. A more fitting epitaph may be: John McCain, Father, Husband, Son. And that's not bad at all.

I disagree. His integrity, accomplishment, and hard work in his life has inspired many others to follow a principled life. He is a role model for the new generation.
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